THE ZOMBI APOCALIPS HAS BEGUN!!!!!!!!

[Seth]

History shows us very clearly, even nations that do not forget their fathers, fall.
Like Aztech, Maya, Egyptians, Sumerian, Akkadians, etc...

Learning what your ancestors did or believe is very important, I agree.
But when I read you, it sounds like I must worship them or give them more respect than the one they desevre.
They were men, as you said. And act like men, in good and evil, with intelligence or stupidity.
And they didn't do what they did for us but for themselves, at least for the huge majority of what we called "our ancestors".

As for your idea of Calvin and Luther leading us to freedom... well that is a religious subject so I'll just say that Calvin, a french man, and Luther put people in trials for sorcery and Luther even gave credit to the slaughters of various rebels, anabaptists.
He was a conviced antisemit (which was normal at the time though) and Islam was a tool of the Devil.
Well, if this is your idea of who will lead the human kind to freedom... I guess that is because you must be protestant or american (I don't know where you from). But as a french, I just see them as authoritarian religious people quick to judge and condemn  to death those who do not have the same believes.

[TheBadger]

Maya and aztec  are roman catholic, these people are still here today. They took on new fathers and their old cultures died. I'm not familiar with some of the others.
On egypt you will have to be more precise. Old kingdom, new kingdom, Roman, (hellenistic), christian, Muslim?

I do not worship the dead. I did not mean to imply that. Honestly, I don't know how you could have concluded that. I mean I know I'm not a great writer, but thats a big jump.

Perhaps it is my writing, perhaps not. But you totally missed the point.
Everything that was bad that you mentioned in history, lead to something good. And those good things lead to better things.
Calvin and Luther lead to other thinkers who led to better ideas, Ideas that would not likely have come if the people did not come first. In the end, they broke the power of Rome, but not by them selves. What ever bad you think they did, it is nothing compared to the good they lead to.

You can not separate the men form the history, cause from effect. Otherwise you are talking about some alternate universe.

[Seth]

maybe the problem is not your writing but my reading

Maya and Aztec, as a civilization, could be considered as finished, and the Egyptian civilization is over too.
The people living in the area now, are not the same that the one that built the pyramids and worshiped the "animal Gods".
They were not the muslims arabs.

But anyway, I understand what you mean and I agree with you last point !

That said, in all that long History, we never had a zombie invasion

[TheBadger]

Its cool Seth. Actually I have grown to like arguing with you. We talk about lots of strange things in these threads.

One thing I hope we can agree on is that its better to have a shotgun than to not have a shotgun, when the zombies attack in hordes!

Here is a cute one for everyone to enjoy
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-k1rTfK3fcNc/TfUkXMxI2iI/AAAAAAAABNs/SOj7BlRYhbc/s1600/notsexyatall.jpg

Rule #21

[Seth]

Shotgun ! definitely shotgun ! ^^

Yeah, me too, I like arguing and you are a good client

[penang]

absolutely, Kadri.
humans and apes have common ancestor, but humans do not descend from apes !!!
that is 1950's bullshit.

your so-called fact,penang , is as relevant as the God created the worl in 7 days theory.

you don't seem to know that humankind already had different branches and that homo-sapiens sapiens (yeah two sapiens, not just one) already took care of the others, dealing with them in a way or the other (killing them or melting with them).
and I don't think drugs can accelerate evolution and blablabla.

I used the word "Ape", but I didn't write "Modern Ape"

If I had written "Human species evolved from modern ape", you would have every right to rant at me, at the way you did

But I did not

I merely wrote "The human species evolved from apes"

That word "Ape", at least in all the dictionary I could find, didn't specify that it only denotes "Modern Ape"

It could be "Ancient Ape", "Prehistoric Ape", "Modern Ape", "Space Ape", or any kind of "Ape" there was/is/will be

I kinda get a feeling that some people here, those with attitude, have a penchant to find faults when there is none

Last time, on another thread, a Frenchman so courteously gave me a psycho-analysis, completely free of charge

And this time, on this thread ....

Hmm ....

But anyway, I do hope that you feel satisfy now, Seth, after that ranting of yours

[JimB]

Later, my ancestors believed that the Earth was flat ....

The flat Earth myth is just that: a myth, which still pervades modern views on our ancestors. The Earth's been known to be spherical since at least the time of the ancient Greeks, and the vast majority of scholars throughout history have known it to be so. The myth was propagated by fiction novelists in the 19th and early 20th Centuries, Washington Irving included. Being described as a flatearther at the time of Cyrnao de Bergerac was a gross insult to someone's credibility.

[TheBadger]

Ha!

Thats funny JimB, I did not know that... About the fiction.

But now that I think about it, it does seem really strange that people would think the earth was flat when all they had to do was look, I mean among scholars.
Plus, even when a lot of things were forgotten during the aftermath of the fall of Rome, there were still books, and trade. And I'm rather sure people had eyes and brains for most of history too.

Yeah, you know I never liked this smarter than thou attitude modern man takes when talking about the past. Lets see someone from our time build a pyramid, then I will be impressed.

Good one Jim.

[penang]

There's a discussion on the evolution of primate / simian on slashdot, especially the below comment:

http://science.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2899721&cid=40240871

[Seth]

Later, my ancestors believed that the Earth was flat ....

The flat Earth myth is just that: a myth, which still pervades modern views on our ancestors. The Earth's been known to be spherical since at least the time of the ancient Greeks, and the vast majority of scholars throughout history have known it to be so. The myth was propagated by fiction novelists in the 19th and early 20th Centuries, Washington Irving included. Being described as a flatearther at the time of Cyrnao de Bergerac was a gross insult to someone's credibility.

"The church says the earth is flat, but I know that it is round, for I have seen the shadow on the moon, and I have more faith in a shadow than in the church" Magellan
Take a look at some writing from Herodotus, Thales, Homere and Hesiode.
Germanic people and Vikings (or Norse, I am not sure) belived the Earth was flat.
the Japanese, in the Nihongi, describe Earth as flat.
Same thing for ancient Chinese people... they even thought it was square and flat.

as for Cyrano, it is not the middle-age but the Renaissance.

So I understand we should not patronize our ancestors and their believes but we must not give them more credit and modernity than what they were by the time.

I kinda get a feeling that some people here, those with attitude, have a penchant to find faults when there is none

Last time, on another thread, a Frenchman so courteously gave me a psycho-analysis, completely free of charge

And this time, on this thread ....

Hmm ....

But anyway, I do hope that you feel satisfy now, Seth, after that ranting of yours

Considering uor previous posts, on the threads you open on this forum (not in the image, animations, or files sharing, of course...), I think you know exactly what is a person with an attitude
And I am curious about your sentence on french people... Can you explain what you mean ?
because you had an argument one time and being criticize (I guess that is what you call  psycho-analysis) another time by a french, you not even notice the nationality of your "opponent" but you write it publicly, with some "..." at the end, not finishing the idea you started.
Are you afraid to say outloud what you think ?

[JimB]

"The church says the earth is flat, but I know that it is round, for I have seen the shadow on the moon, and I have more faith in a shadow than in the church" Magellan

The Magellan quote: another myth. The earliest example of the quote can only be found in Robert Green Ingersoll's 1873 essay, 'Individuality'. Ingersoll is one of the very people I speak of in my previous comment.

Take a look at some writing from Herodotus, Thales, Homere and Hesiode.

Take a look at some writings by Pythagoras, Aristotle, Euclid, Aristarchus, Eratosthenes, Crates, Strabo, Ptolemy.

Germanic people and Vikings (or Norse, I am not sure) belived the Earth was flat.
the Japanese, in the Nihongi, describe Earth as flat.
Same thing for ancient Chinese people... they even thought it was square and flat.

So why are you [mis]quoting Magellan about the Western church? As for the Norse, that'd be the people who settled Greenland and made it as far as North America without falling off the edge of the Earth, right?

[TheBadger]

All in all, this has got to be one of the stranger threads.

[PabloMack]

As french man, I can tell that I don't know anyone in France believing in creationism....and at the same time, if you tell them that human evolved from apes, they will laugh at you and call you ignorant.

Seth, thank you for your input. These two disparate beliefs seem to leave the French belief system with no origin at all for man. How do you explain this? I think it is simply "denial". But keep in mind that the English word "ingnorance" comes from the infinitive "to ignore" which means much the same as denial. What is the etymology of  the French word for "ignorance"?

It wasn't very many years ago that evolutionary taxonomists moved the "other great apes of africa" from Pongidae to Hominidae. In other words, we didn't evolve FROM apes because we ARE apes. What this means is that the chimpanzees and gorillas are more closely related to hominids than to orangutans which are in the genus Pong (the nominal genus of the family Pongidae). This is backed up by DNA studies.

On another note, I feel a bit of sympathy for my Euro Terragen brethren. Our laws in America permit us to defend ourselves in the Zombie apocalypse. I have my Mossberg 500 Zombie killer all ready to go. It is a 1+7 12 gauge pump shot gun. 1+7 means one in the chamber plus seven in the magazine. I think the ZMB logo is a registered trademark of Mossberg. By the way, John Browning (an American) invented the pump action. He was just as involved in the development of European fire arms as he was in developing American weapons. He is recognized as the most prolific gun inventor in world history.

http://www.tactical-life.com/online/products/mossberg-zmb-series/1/

[attach=1]

I love the History Channel series "Tales of the Gun". Here is the one about John Browning:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZxKOBmO4aU

[TheBadger]

These two disparate beliefs seem to leave the French belief system with no origin at all for man. How do you explain this?

[attachimg=1]

PabloMack,

I have a pimped out AR. But I needs me a semi auto shoty! Maybe by Christmas

[penang]

These two disparate beliefs seem to leave the French belief system with no origin at all for man. How do you explain this?

Have mercy

Don't be so cruel