Soft Shadow work around (with image)

Started by moodflow, June 02, 2007, 11:17:44 PM

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Volker Harun

Hi Matt,
call it an obsession - I just love cloud samples  :D
To be honest, I saw some noise in the atmospheres and pushed up both atmospheres' samples.
It was a very quick setup and I did not have time for serious test renders.
Volker

Volker Harun

The second file is uploading - it is a bit smaller (maybe due to less cloud samples?) ,)
Downloadlink

I beg everybody who checks this file not to hurt me - as it is very simple.
But well, it worked  ;) :D ;D

Volker

Volker Harun

The most effective setup for me - at the moment - is, using the 8° softlight at 300° and adding two fill lights. One at 60°, the other at 180° (using 45° elevation(?)) - each has strength of '1', all options (shadows, glow) are turned off.
It is a dream with plants ,-)

Matt

#63
Here are two images rendered with Volker's project file. I disabled ray traced shadows on the clouds, but otherwise the scene is similar the image Volker posted.

Using moodflow's "8 degree" soft light setup using 21 suns, 10 hours 37 minutes:

[attachthumb=1]

Using built-in soft shadows with 9 shadow samples, 6 hours 20 minutes:

[attachthumb=2]

The soft shadow diameter was set to 32 degrees to approximate the diameter of the multiple sun setup.

Matt
Just because milk is white doesn't mean that clouds are made of milk.

moodflow

Very nice tests here.  They are nearly identical, except for the shortened render time of the built-in soft shadows.  This is definitely going to bring TGTP to the next level.

Thanks Matt.
http://www.moodflow.com
mood-inspiring images and music

Matt

#65
More about the above comparison. There are two reasons why this rendered faster using the built-in soft shadows. Firstly I only used 9 shadow samples, rather than 21 as in the multiple-sun setup. The built-in soft shadows are able to randomise the sample positions which means you don't need as many samples or suns to avoid steps in the shadow boundaries, so 9 samples are adequate for this scene. Second, the built-in soft shadows use less shadow samples when calculating the light falling on the clouds and atmosphere, because the quality reduction there is less noticeable. That optimisation is not possible if you use the multiple sun trick.

Because of the optimisations in soft shadows on the clouds, I expect that if I had enabled ray-traced shadows in the clouds the speed difference would be much greater.

Matt
Just because milk is white doesn't mean that clouds are made of milk.

rcallicotte

The built-in soft shadow has a slightly greater amount of contrast, which I like.  Something I learned quickly in black & white photography is that a little more contrast is better and portrays the reality of the scene better.  So this is much better.

Will this built-in soft shadow be available in the next update or will we need to wait a bit for a more complete package?
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

Matt

Calico,

Yep, the soft shadows are ready to go. This option will appear in the next update, in the Sunlight node and in the Light Source node.

I think the apparent increase in contrast is due to the sample positions not corresponding 100% to the 21 sun positions. I think the multi-sun setup might give similar results if the suns were slightly closer together. In fact, 32 degrees is an unrealistically large sun diameter ;) and although such soft shadows can be cast by haze and clouds they tend not to be as pronounced as in this scene. But it's still pleasing to the eye nevertheless.

Matt
Just because milk is white doesn't mean that clouds are made of milk.

Volker Harun

Very nice ... very! So, shall I stop rendering until the next update? ,)

rcallicotte

I like it.  This new addition is a great step forward and an additional thing to look forward to using.  Brilliant!
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

Matt

Here's a cropped render with 3 suns to simulate hazy sunshine. 0.5 degrees, 15 degrees, 45 degrees. The 0.5 degree sun is the direct sunlight, and the other softer suns are an attempt to simulate diffused sunlight coming from a high layer of cloud or haze.

Theoretically this hazy sunlight could be calculated by the GI, but very high quality settings would be needed to achieve this.

[attachthumb=#]

Matt
Just because milk is white doesn't mean that clouds are made of milk.

Volker Harun

Very nice effect, Matt - now you should add an output that can be connected to single groups. (only having an effect on terrain, importet objects ,-) ) :D

AndyWelder

Haroon suggested posting this here so it's his fault ;-)
I've created a spread-sheet for the soft shadows clip-file; makes it a bit easier to calculate the Heading and Elevation values for all the suns when moving the 'Main Sun'.
Nothing fancy really, just type the values of the Heading and Elevation of the Main Sun in and the values for the other suns will change accordingly. It has two other calculators for a more horizontal and a more vertical oriented configuration too.
Wish I knew how to automatically adjust the data in the clip file...
"Ik rotzooi maar wat aan" Karel Appel

Volker Harun

I've modified the 8° Softshadow to become a single 16° setup. I deleted all thos lights that have a distance of 8° to the main. It works very good and it is of course faster.
I changed each sun power to 0.3.
At least it works on that rough surface I have in my current scene ,-)

Volker Harun

moodflow

Quote from: AndyWelder on July 21, 2007, 05:16:00 PM
Haroon suggested posting this here so it's his fault ;-)
I've created a spread-sheet for the soft shadows clip-file; makes it a bit easier to calculate the Heading and Elevation values for all the suns when moving the 'Main Sun'.
Nothing fancy really, just type the values of the Heading and Elevation of the Main Sun in and the values for the other suns will change accordingly. It has two other calculators for a more horizontal and a more vertical oriented configuration too.
Wish I knew how to automatically adjust the data in the clip file...


Andy,

How do we use this file?  I tried opening it with a few different apps, but no luck.

Many thanks...
http://www.moodflow.com
mood-inspiring images and music