Render Settings

Started by efflux, June 27, 2007, 10:43:37 AM

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efflux

My latest render:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/media/folder_147/file_1469742.jpg

It has had some post work. Mainly colour (due to badly calibrated monitor on my Windows system) and level adjustments with some minor blurring and sharpening in regions. Nothing major though.

I'm trying out different rendering settings to get a minimum render time for a reasonable quality. Render time was just less than 6 hours on a P4 3.0 Ghz. It's crucial to experiment with this stuff because it can cut many hours off render times.

Detail            0.9
Anti-aliasing         3
GI relative detail      2
GI sample quality      2
Atmosphere samples   32

Global illumination was used. I also turned detail blending down to 0.5 because I'm experimenting with trying not to get too blurry an output. Detail blending does end up in a loss of definition. I make the assumption that detail blending is blending geometry detail? I turned down the default samples settings for the highest clouds. In a scene like this, cloud samples for the higher cloud layers could probably be less due to being obscured by a thicker atmosphere. I will experiment with that. What does the setting simply labeled as "quality" do exactly for clouds? GI could have been even less and maybe detail - this seems to be the crucial one. Keep detail as low as you can get away with. I did not use GI surface detail.

However the image wasn't as smooth as it could have been. I needed some settings turned up. As I said, it has been slightly post worked to rectify inadequate render settings but I'm going to get this right because I want bigger renders in the future.

I don't get much chance to use TG at the moment so this is my first try with the last update. It still freezes my system now and again. I haven't tested the newer Mac version yet. Ultimately I want to run it on the Mac but I'll only do that when TG does Multi core.

rcallicotte

Very cool.   It almost seems like the dark shadow is unrendered, though.
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

efflux

#2
Thanks.

Yes you're right about the shadows. The shadows do not to have much detail inside them. I think the realism of shadows is in general a poor area of 3D graphics. I think this especially shows with shadows in TG's volumetric clouds when they are cumulus but to get that looking realistic at any reasonable render times would probably be impossible. I'm noticing that on all my stuff, shadows are very dark, from other apps as well. I tend to set the ambient light colour very dark. I think I just like that effect though. Big areas of dark colour.

Actually, the way I am seeing my shadows may be different to how other viewers see them. I have a high quality monitor here with very high contrast ratio. Any black areas are very dark. Shadows on my renders may appear a bit washed out on other monitors. My monitor may be showing some shading that doesn't get seen too well on another monitor. I should check that.

I might look into changing all this extreme darkness in shadows.

Oshyan

The shadows do look extremely dark - I would say unnaturally so. This seems odd if GI was on since one of the main purposes of it is to add definition to shadowed areas. So if you want to cut down render time, and since you don't have any dense clouds here that would benefit more from the GI shading enhancements in clouds, you might just try turning GI off altogether here. A fill light setup (without shadow casting) might substitute if you even notice a difference, but I suspect you may not, and it would save a lot in render time.

The Quality setting in clouds is just another way to adjust samples; it's designed to give people a general idea of a good sample level for a given cloud setup. It is scaled relative to an approximated estimate of the number of samples needed to get acceptable cloud quality (low noise) based on several factors including cloud density and depth/height.

Detail Blending works similarly to TG 0.9's Extra Blended Detail - it blends micropolygon samples. It could be said it results in a "loss of detail", but it could also be seen the other way - that lowering it simply increases artificial sharpness, which I often find has a fairly obvious computer-generated look. Generally, as with digital photography, sharpening in post is preferred. Compensating for lowered detail blending with higher AA is probably not a good solution either. I have experimented myself with lowering detail blending and the results can be acceptable in some cases. It certainly does lower render time a lot too, but I wouldn't consider it a general solution for most scenes.

Of course everyone's preference for image sharpness varies - I find a great many TG images posted in public galleries are oversharpened for my taste. I think this corresponds with the general public's apparent preference for this level of artificial sharpness, as evidenced by digital camera maker's in-camera image processing bias of high sharpening in most cases.

- Oshyan

ProjectX

I find that screen-type makes the most difference.

Before, I was using a TFT screen to view the galleries and almost all of them were fine, now I use an LCD screen and the sharpness is so superb with this screen that I find that TG2 renders rarely (if ever) need additional sharpening.

Asfor the image, it has a wonderful perspective and great terrain, the only problem is that the shadows are far to dark, if you are going to follow Oshyan's advice, I'd make sure to add the fill-light setup to add a bit of colour and brightness to the dark areas.

efflux

#5
OK thanks. I noticed a thread somewhere on here about fill lights. That looks like an interesting thing to test.

Yes, now I see about the cloud quality setting because it changes the samples. I never noticed that.

Yes sure, the detail setting could be useful. All renders have different needs. I think my stuff tends to have large plain areas but smaller details that I'm trying to keep sharper now. Yes I see the sense in using higher detail blending and then sharpening in post.

Shadows is definitely something I will look into and experiment with. I never actually noticed how dark shadows were in my stuff. It's just a kind of preference I seem to have veered towards to get shapes. Just a style I quite like.

Since I got this Eizo I have gone back to view images I liked on galleries etc and they look totally different on a number of levels. The Eizo is not really for the Windows system even although it has a dual DVI input. I have the Eizo hooked to a Mac and Linux system. I've got another monitor attached to the Windows box now. Both monitors are LCDs but the Eizo is still sharper. Yes, I'd have over sharpened stuff if not using the Eizo.

I'd definitely recommend a really good monitor if you have the cash because it's the most important part if you're doing graphics and it will last a long time. It's only when you put two monitors side by side that you see the difference. The trouble is when you go to a computer store the monitors are generally all similar but once you see a really good one beside an OK one, there is a big difference and sometimes there is not such a big difference in price.

Thanks for the replies, opinions, etc.