Vegetation

Started by ohara, September 09, 2009, 10:35:42 AM

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ohara

Hello, i looked at many pictures here in galery, there are lot of photorealistic landscapes, but most of vegetation not look so much naturaly. We develop software for generation of realistic realTime vegetation. Maybe it could interest or help to somebody. http://linda.bistudio.com/#Results

inkydigit

some of these trees look excellent, does Linda run on a Mac?
how much does it cost?
have you got any freebies to share with us?   
do you do requests?

ohara

Most of answers are at end of linda wbsite. It run only on PC (some parts of simulation is made on grafic card - shaders to be fast- need DX support).

Seth

#3
I did this with vegetation lately. Is it possible do to better ? because I see only bad quality renders on your examples page so I wonder what is possible. (I don't want to sound mean).
I understand you do it for real time but... well what is possible for us Terrageneers ? :D

http://www.flickr.com/photos/7thcircle/3892467702/sizes/o/
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3466/3891680825_71b2c38707_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3480/3894980483_3acb07f59d_o.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2546/3891684355_86cefce398_o.jpg

most of the answer are maybe on the website but inky asked about price... and i must say i didn't find it on the website. Maybe I just missed it :/

old_blaggard

Interesting work. The real-time galleries are impressive, but it would be useful to have examples of higher-quality renders. It would also be nice to have more details about the pricing (on your page you say that it's available upon request... consider this an open request to see how much it costs :) ) and any pre-build models and libraries available.
http://www.terragen.org - A great Terragen resource with models, contests, galleries, and forums.

latego

Quote from: old_blaggard on September 09, 2009, 12:40:37 PM
It would also be nice to have more details about the pricing (on your page you say that it's available upon request... consider this an open request to see how much it costs :) ) and any pre-build models and libraries available.

It is never a good sign when there is not a public, official price list. It stinks a mile away of a let's-see-how-much-we-can-get-out-of-todays-sucker plot.

Bye  :-\

Henry Blewer

Not exactly the most informative site. I might check it out again in a few months.
http://flickr.com/photos/njeneb/
Forget Tuesday; It's just Monday spelled with a T

ohara

Main advantage is possibility to build and fast render massive scenes, we have in realtime more than hundrets of thousands trees. Linda is able to make models from few to 300000 polygons per model. To pricing, i dont know whats are rules of that forums to discuse it here, we offer it as service, when hour of operator is 100 euro or license it, price of license depends on maitanance, library and so on, for that is better to contact us dirrectly. We are more focusing on realtime or very fast rendering (look at www.arma2.com or www.vbs2.com) but i think it still could be interesting for some offline rendering users.

Zylot

I am not seeing this as being incredibly useful for Terragen users who want high quality models to put into it's own rendering engine (not using Linda's).  Top this with a crazy price (100 euro an hour?!) and no straight answer of licensing costs, I believe this is not the right market for your software.

ohara

Linda is not rendering software, its model genertor, output is FBX format, there are some realtime results in our engine (all vegetation are products of linda generator) http://www.arma2.com/nature_en.html

Henry Blewer

In order to be useful for Terragen 2, you'd have to be able to use the data that Terragen 2 generates. Terragen 2 has a very powerful instancing algorithm. I have actually render over 1 million trees in a few of my landscapes. Since Terragen 2 is so capable, I don't see how much difference your product could make.
Where you could make a splash here is to offer the tree generator software for private use. XFrog is wonderful, but more tools never hurt.
http://flickr.com/photos/njeneb/
Forget Tuesday; It's just Monday spelled with a T

ohara

What i saw xfrog does not know to make LODs so much good. So when Linda can help is to generate much more and  proper LODs, I expect this can make instacing in teragen much more effective (less memory expensive) - rendering faster.

Walli

no, it can´t at least as far as I know. The reason is that terragen does not swap out models depending on camera distance. So you have to decide for one LOD.

Also I noticed that swapping out models doesn´t help so much. I know it works well in realtime engines (by the way, I like those plants, look good to me), but mostly not so much in offline renderers like Terragen, Mentalray, Vray and so on.
First of all you usually have to hold several LOD´s in memory, from lowpoly to highpoly - that would be higher RAM consumption then just highpoly (and in most cases you have some objects near the camera, that really all LODs have to be in memory).
Second, lowpoly plants often don´t render faster, because they usually use big billboard planes to save geometry - but thats something that most offline renderers don´t really like.
Actually I just work on a project where I even go the other direction - instead of the high poly plants I even use more detailed plants - that brings me near the memory limit, but it renders faster because the engine does not have to trace so many alpha/billboard planes.

But I think Matt knows best and probably will proof me wrong here ;-)

As i said, I like those plants, even if they are out of my budget (well, I usually do my own plants anyways). 100 Euro for an operator might sound steep to many users here, but it is indeed a realistic price tag.

ohara

I dont know so much about offline renderers, but with  LODs in memory, i expect that there must be some kind of streaming. Cant imagine that all objects are together in memory, especially when camera mooving (typical in RT landscape renderers). With a price for operateor, Linda is extremly efective, so in fact in 3-5 days is operator able to create veg models with all lods and spec. geometry for typical game project.