Trees constructed in Speedtree Architect, Manzanita ground cover from Speedtree store. Personal assets for bark and pine needles. Terrain from World Machine. These are my first attempts with ST, so any awkwardness in the trees should not reflect negatively on the program. Comments welcome.
Nice image, excellent trees.
great going so far! Nice tree type to model. I am curious id you can do debris with ST, like piles of fallen needles, and dead sticks and stuff? THe kind of thing just about every TG render is missing.
Very promising indeed. Are you still working on these? Hope to see them in a higher resolution render at some point.
- Oshyan
Thanks for the kind comments. It seems whenever you start to create natural scenes or elements it certainly triggers a new level of observation of the actual world, the almost obsessive thought pattern of, "now how can I do THAT in my software package". I am definitely viewing trees with a keener eye these days! Also, you really have to appreciate the work of folks like Walli, Robert Czarny, Martin Frost, et al who have modeled actual tree species with such excellence over the years. But now with the advent of tools like Speedtree and The Plant Factory, complex arboreal scenes are within reach, even for non-pro's such as myself .
TheBadger: I love debris! Had the same thought but put it off. Don't know about using ST for that, but T3 and the Distribution Shader seems to work. I cobbled together a quick dead pine needle object and it scattered okay in a test, but I need to play around a bit more before posting anything.
Oshayn: Yup, still working on them. Trying to get a better pine cluster asset (5 needle structure). Creating bark, branch, leaf, needle cluster, frond, assets is a separate endeavor, but there are some nice tools out there to help. Some higher res images are awaiting some more-refined tree sets.
Here's another image with the sample LOW RES conifers that come with the software. The ground cover is Dune's marvelous Heather. The Speedtree crew calls these objects "RT" (real-time). They populate readily into T3 and render fairly quickly. Speedtree objects are procedural and endless variations can be had by pushing the "randomize" button. The possibility to create an endless supply of ugly trees is now at your finger-tips! ;D
Once again, comments welcome.
Thanks for the credit on the heather. They really come out good in your render.
One thing that I noticed in your tree is the bark; I think you need to up the U and V tiling.
Really well done
The fallen tree looks about perfect to me.
Here is another image and the latest iteration of my 'kinda-sorta' Whitebark Pine (Pinus Albicaulis). The Speedtree tools 'feel' solid and mostly intuitive, even though I've gotten myself bollixed up with tweaking too many settings at once ;D. However, and this turns out to be a fairly significant 'however': IDV, the makers of Speedtree have the same kind of EULA restraints that e-on's The Plant Factory has. Any models (defined as "Meshes" - even using your own leaf/pine/frond/bark assets) created with Speedtree cannot be redistributed in any fashion (even free). When queried on the Speedtree forum the Marketing Manager confirmed the restrictions in 'plain language', but did say that the Company was considering changing that policy. One would hope that they do. While Speedtree and TPF are not strictly speaking DCC applications, it still seems a little 'tight' to claim any user created object as still being controlled by the software publisher: think of all the Max/Maya/ models being 'restricted' by Autodesk? It's true that both IDV and e-on have retail plant stores and affiliated model makers to consider: still, can some hobbyists creating and distributing trees and resources be that much of a threat? The freedom to custom create and 'fit' hero trees and specialized tree populations into T3 is an obvious desire, hopefully either one or both of those Companies change their stance. How legally enforceable is this? Who knows? In the meantime ST is a very mature and well thought out piece of software.
Hey Zaxxon , Great images. Have got Speedtree, but so far when I import what appears to be a completed tree into T3 it just renders as a white blob, no textures. Frustrating. Any idea what I am missing? The wire frame shows up nicely, and so does a shaded textured tree in the preview, but I lose it in the render.
rat.
Holiday greetings ratfugel! Seems ST has a plethora of export options, which is a good thing. There are a couple of very precise scripts to go to Max and Maya for VRay and MR, be nice to see how to optimize the output to T3. The way I'm bringing trees into T3 is to export as an .obj, the attachment below shows the ST settings that seem to work pretty well. Hopefully those settings will do it for you. Make sure that the same 'color' image in the T3 material slot (should be there upon load) for the leaves/pine needles is also copied into the 'opacity' slot with the 'use alpha channel' box selected.
If you're using the sample trees they default to .tga as output, so the exporter should be set to .png or whatever you like that T3 likes. Let me know how it goes.
The tree looks real great! close up please!
That's right; the white blobs are most probably the alpha channel messing up. Same with XFrog trees. In Zaxxon's file you can see a few where the branch tips' (caps) opacity tab isn't set (yet). White blobs happen whenever there is an alpha channel in the textures. For bark you don't need it generally, for leaves you do,
Thanks a lot Zaxxon, just come in and got your reply. thanks again for promptitude ( nice new word). Will do as you say and let you see the result if any. I was beginning to think I should try it in a snowfield.
Happy, Healthy and possibly Prosperous New Year to everyone.
rat.
You are very welcome ratfugel, hope that does it. I had the same issue initially, Dune is correct about some of my models "caps" being without the alpha channel, still working on getting some good image assets for chopped and broken branches. ST models need some of the same 'tweakings' that xfrog objects need (at least in my limited experience); so boost the 'translucency' levels as well for the leave/pine needle settings, I'm using between 1.0 and 3.0. While I can't share the tree models I'm certainly up for posting my beginneriest (there's a new word back at ya ratsfugel ;)) image assets if there's any interest. Also, as Dune pointed out earlier in this thread, take note of the UV tile settings in ST to make sure the repeat isn't too obvious in T3. ST really does have a lot of controls to sort thru at first, and I'm just scratching the surface, not to mention trying to make the models have a botanical flow and balance within a given environment.
Still trying to export ST trees successfully into TG3. Tree visible in preview ,white blobs gone, but left with silhouette. Not clever. (Obj. settings in ST as suggested). However, I did notice that my files have the materials for leaves and bark, but that's where they seem to stay. If I try to import them the tree image disappears from the preview. Still not clever. However I did notice that when I was still at the white blob stage, just before the blobs appeared during rendering, the leaves etc seemed to be visible briefly in colour, then they got covered over with white during the remainder of the render. As they say on the reports, 'must try harder'. Got the feeling I'm going to be restricted to rendering sand dunes and deserts at this rate. Thank God for TreePro which I bought a few years ago.
rat.
Try going into the T3 material settings for the 'branches' and also copy that 'color' image into the 'opacity' slot and check the 'use opacity channel' box. The branches in ST often are what ST calls 'fronds' and allow a greater control over leaf/branch shaping, but need the opacity channel set. If you're using the ST sample broadleaf I can screen copy all the relevant settings and post if the going is still not right. Also, the ST leaf asset .tga's have a green tinted background that via other export methods allows a greater level of detail than the .obj format allows (transmission, texture coordinates); so maybe trying other assets might help, xfrog leaf/needle images work quite well in ST and can then be saved out as obj's to T3 (hopefully not violating any EULA if only used personally as a test).
Thanks again Zaxxon. I think a screengrab might help whilst I'm at it (Just in case). I'd like to get this right as SpeedTree is actually the best I've seen. I've got TreeFrog and all it's variations coming out of my ears, but it's very labored to get just what you want. ST seems to have got the thing sorted. If a clown like me could get ST into TG3 nicely, it might just encourage others to have a go.
rat.
Post the .tgd file, if you could, so we can get a look at it?
bit late noticing this but fine work so far. just dl'd the evaluation version and doubt I'll be able to ever afford this at nearly 5 yards but am curious anyway..thanks for posting this....
Thanks again for the comments and the viewing. Here is a .tgc that will map the materials to the ST sample tree named BroadLeaf_HighDetail. I've also attached a displacement map for the bark generated from the diffuse map to include in the T3 render (ST puts out normal maps). For Ratfugel: You should be able to load the sample tree into ST and output to T3 with the prior posted settings and then just 'insert' the .tgc into the internal network for the tree. I've had some issues with that, unless the original 'Parts Shader' is first disabled and then disconnected from the surface shader, then connect the new inserted Part Shader. Unfortunately you'll have to go thru and match the image files from wherever you have saved them, my computer's directory structure is a personal labyrinth ;).
Bobby, I feel your pain, even the least costly option is $495, and I've come to the conclusion that the 'Studio' version at $895 is the more robust option (ouch!). Here's an image of the BroadLeaf sample in T3 as well.
Thanks Zaxxon. The image proves it can be done. Nice. Grateful for the Tgc etc. Working on it. Understand your remarks about program mods. Will post later if it all goes as advertised. Ho,hum!
(Incidentally, I actually managed to get the trunk OK complete with correctly coloured bark. As it was rendering I could see the leaf colouring before it got buried in the big white blobs).
I just gotta crack this otherwise my fearless leader will probably go off with the postman, and then where would we be.
rat.
Was about to ask why it was a .tgc and not a .tgo then sussed out that'd be redistribution. Do y know if you can export from the Eval. version...to save me in and unin stalling it if you can't.
I'm not famliar with Speedtree, but if I was seeing big white blobs in xFrog it (usually) would mean that my image mask is missing when I was rendering in TG.
Now that Zaxxon's provided the info I was able to do the transfer. As he said it's more than a bit tricky, but I'm quite pleased with how it's rendered. Thanks again for all the help, sorry to have been a nuisance getting you to do the detailed explanation for me. Now I can tell the postman to sod off.
rat.
Well done! Nice looking tree.
Is that tree here to use for all, or do you need ST to make it work? It sure is pretty!
Ta-Daaa! Looks great Ratfugel! I'm looking forward to your next creations with T3 & ST. Michael, unfortunately ST has very similar restrictions to The Plant Factory when it comes to meshes produced with the software, so the trees cannot be shared (IDV the makers of ST have said they are reconsidering the policy though). Bobby: the eval copy of ST will save out a decimated mesh as an .obj, however in my estimation it's a disappointing tease when used with Terragen. Hey Rat, try the 'randomize' button (cleverly iconized as a set of dice) and save a few of those out to T3 using the tgc to set the materials, sheer tree madness! Here's a quick test with the sample ash tree 'randomized'.
Damn that looks good............... 8)
That is impressive!
Great example! Just great. I guess you get what you pay for :)
Glad that the ST example went down OK with you Zaxxon. I must admit that I was on tenterhooks when I pressed the render button. Now it seems that I must restrict my enthusiasm to creating proper images with a true centre of interest, with the now realistic trees backing up whatever I come up with. Having been a photographic competition judge for many years I tend to consider content and impact before worrying too much about technicalities. Pretty the trees might be, but they shouldn't dominate the image, otherwise folks might just get fed up with looking at lumps of timber with leaves on. I guess that most people using 3D programs are aiming for near-photographic accuracy. That said, most photographs are ephemeral and soon lose their attraction. That's why paintings dominate walls, not photos. (Oh yes, and don't forget Banksy, he's in this somewhere!). To sum up, I think the thing that actually carries the day in this game is creativity. You've either got it or you haven't. I don't think it can be taught. The world is just full of wannabee creators.
rat. (draws breath).
Ahhh yes, the summoning of the muse... No arguments from me, technical skills only go so far. However a lovely "lump of timber with leaves on it" can be a wonderful sight. Your views of the photographic contrasted with the painterly may not be universal, but are probably nearer to my own. Discussing the philosophy of what constitutes true Art is best enjoyed with fine beverages and even finer friends :). I'll look with anticipation for your new work!
It's a shame that the restrictions on sharing personally created meshes from ST, in addition to the high price of the app, will limit these additional tree objects from many Terragen artists. I wish it were not so.
Here's one more image from me in this thread: it's a 'population' from one tree, with one additional single tree. This once again is a sample tree that comes with ST, modified with the 'randomize' button (not even to be confused with the 'create art' button ;)).
I really appreciate all of the kind comments and I'll post any further images in a separate thread. I wish everyone health, happiness and success in the coming year!
The last image on page2 is outstanding.
Thank you Zaxxon for your princely comments. I recall once meeting a famous artist who said to me "There's nothing so stately as a Winter tree!" At first I wasn't too sure what he meant, but when I studied trees later, bare of leaves I began to understand. They have a magnificence all of their own. I know we like to see trees in T3 fully clad, but sometimes a lone ancient trunk can carry great meaning if you care to look. That fine photographer, Ansel Adams knew this and cashed in on it. In the meantime, Zaxxon, I have a recurrent problem, in that I am having a fine old time trying repeat what I first achieved. Can you tell me how you created the Broadleaf Tgc file and do you have a sequence of operations before actually rendering? I have disabled the shaders etc as suggested and copied in the Tgc OK. However, come what may, the tree image keeps on turning up black. Sometimes with leaves, sometimes without. Confusing to say the least. There's probably a simple answer.
rat.
Sorry to hear that repeating the process is problematic. Creating a .tgc is pretty straightforward; right-click the object in the 'network view' select the 'internal network' , right-click the object connected to 'object maker', right-click that and select 'internal network', that should show the connected 'part shader', left-click and select the 'part shader' then right-click that and select 'save nodes as clip file'. You may want to reload the images into the existing part shader slots and see if that corrects the issue. The ST export does not populate all of the slots in the 'part shader' in T3, remember to add the 'opacity' maps (including any 'samplebranch shader') manually. As to any pre-render protocol, not really, I just push the render button :).
Stately naked trees, exemplified by TU's wonderful winter image currently on PS's splash page! "princely" Wow, wait till my Wife hears that!
Did 'princely' trouble you? I should have used the term 'elegant' or even 'erudite' . Both fit the bill. Anyway, thanks for the info. We appear to have the page to ourselves at the moment but I am sure that will change. At first glance I think I have a notion of what might have happened, but we'll see in due course. Grateful for your continued attention to my moaning.
rat.