Indoor work today. Lighting, glass, reflections
Hanne's material share Gold tgc. candleholder (perfecto!)
Hanne's material share Fake wood tgc. floor (minus reflective)
Made this scene first in Blender, I know it needs....decorative accessories...bla, bla....will do.
Questions:
Is there a facsimile for a plane used as a light source with TG? I should try a light source maybe? In this scene i had to add a second sun, with shadows off, and only 0.5 strength, position 180 elevation 25. to see into the room. Or....do I just need more windows, ha?
I added some volume to my glass vase 20, and color 0.875. however is that too much and the probable cause of a light hazing around the object? The object is shelled, like, with inner faces, would that be the culprit?
Thanks in advance for any help, I do use it!
Bobby is the one to answer your lighting question I guess. I did notice the absense of reflection on the glass vase, and the seemingly light emitting candle. Is that on purpose?
Thanks Dune. Yes I put 0.3 lumina on the candle, original setup had a flame atop. I just tried too much crap on the table here. Scaled candle down and moved it to center the vase and add flowers. First renders had reflections on the vase before volume additions. I think maybe the haze is the outer shell of the vase and the greenish the inner lining opposite normals perhaps.
I wanted that sort of "Old World" lighting without just slapping a filter on it out of program.
Yes, indoor lighting is something special in TG. I'd say the windows are very small, so even in real life the room would be quite dark. Nevertheless my advice is to play with the sunlight and the environment light. In my attempts for indoor scenes I increased the sunlight multiplier (a bit) and the environment light (strength on surfaces) a little more as well, until it looked more or less natural. I had to increase the GI settings as well, but imho it's worth it. Using additional lightsources to me only works if there are actually additional lightsources in the scene like lamps or candles.
Talking about the candle: I had a scene with a candle some time ago, and I used a separate object for the flame, set this one to not "cast shadows" and placed an additional light right in the middle of this object. Then I created a very small localised cloud at the exact point where the light and the flame object are, to get some subtle glow around it (see the attached image - the upper one).
And the glass: have you tried to check or uncheck the "double sided surface" feature of the glass shader? By the way there are some glass shaders as well in my materials files.
Oh WOW! Thanks Hannes!
Your renders are super to say the least. As you can tell, I had to import the whole scene as one object, but it is not that hard to change some of the variables, once imported. (Hoping to not go over free version limit with object shaders)
Here I added an image map (simple 256x256 black and white) as a texture for the table cloth, set as displacement function, I only wanted a woven look w/o changing color. I could have also just selected the outer edges and assigned a new material for a border effect, but that is another shader. :) I have all these neat scrolling shapes.....
I went back and changed tris to quads on that vase. (a very old old file made from a spline curve) I will play with the double sided option. Thanks!
Quote from: luvsmuzik on February 03, 2017, 06:13:42 PM
Indoor work today. Lighting, glass, reflections
Hanne's material share Gold tgc. candleholder (perfecto!)
Hanne's material share Fake wood tgc. floor (minus reflective)
Made this scene first in Blender, I know it needs....decorative accessories...bla, bla....will do.
Questions:
Is there a facsimile for a plane used as a light source with TG? I should try a light source maybe? In this scene i had to add a second sun, with shadows off, and only 0.5 strength, position 180 elevation 25. to see into the room. Or....do I just need more windows, ha?
I added some volume to my glass vase 20, and color 0.875. however is that too much and the probable cause of a light hazing around the object? The object is shelled, like, with inner faces, would that be the culprit?
Thanks in advance for any help, I do use it!
Yes but it won't cast shadows. Lately I've been testing using an invisible card object with luminance and coloured area lighting. I use the card because the plae is such a pain to transform easily and the card has handles.
If an object is essentially a solid as yours seems to be I don't think you enable Double sided surface, dunno if that solves your hazing problem though. Basically I haven't found a cross object solution to the glass shader as every object seems to require tweaking a fair bit.
You could send me the object and I could have a run at it.
Hannes: "Talking about the candle: I had a scene with a candle some time ago, and I used a separate object for the flame, set this one to not "cast shadows" and placed an additional light right in the middle of this object. Then I created a very small localised cloud at the exact point where the light and the flame object are, to get some subtle glow around it (see the attached image - the upper one)."
Very good advice. :) Thank you! WIP
Usually to make scenes like that, everyone is using "indoors" GC programs like DS or something close. Cheers to you luvsmuzik for working it out on Terragen! :) Interesting approach.
Quote from: N-drju on February 05, 2017, 04:17:32 PM
Usually to make scenes like that, everyone is using "indoors" GC programs like DS or something close. Cheers to you luvsmuzik for working it out on Terragen! :) Interesting approach.
Oh thank you! I explore Blender a bit, but have always loved Terragen. I was not smart enough to script Ray trace type, so, knowing a little geometry I tried to find something I could experiment with. How hard can it be to build something, heh.....
Got this far with this one in Blender, got hung up with lighting, as usual....
In image two, the beams are dragging the color , not a desired effect....
Nice progress. The glass is looking good now. The grapes don't need glass I would say, but merely a non-RT reflectivity and some translucency, perhaps with tiny drops with RT-reflection. The candle could use a distribution shader (final position altitude, use Y) so only the top (near the flame) is translucent. And that flame!
What Ulco said.
What do you mean by "dragging the color"? The second image is still a bit dark, but it's working. But it's quite flat. Is GISD checked? Occlusion weight?
Quote from: Hannes on February 06, 2017, 08:11:40 AM
What Ulco said.
What do you mean by "dragging the color"? The second image is still a bit dark, but it's working. But it's quite flat. Is GISD checked? Occlusion weight?
I am so sorry. I wasn't clear that those last two images are Blender renders. Dark closeup shot inside a cube with some skylight openings. It is here that I also realized that I had a few too many glossy transparent traslucent shader mixes, etc, but the test was to avoid white speckling ....
In the sunbeam image, rendered in Blender also, it was supposed to be rendered in layers in compositing and later mixed in compositor. If you look you will see the beams catching the gloss from the grapes and from the colors in the paintings, a real no no. If it was stained glass window, that would be great, but ....
Trying to pinpoint successful candle flame object location without putting it on the moon, with the click and copy coordinate method now.
Again, thank you both.
With the power fractal branch to opacity of default shader a too.
Finally ....
My initial experimental flame was much larger scale, but I at least got something. I will probably change the haze color....little bugger was hiding behind the candle for about 15 incremental adjustments before I found it, ha.
Making clip files and notes to self on this one, by the way.
I have several room set ups to try with different lighting, leaving the anchor in default ground zero and not touching position of focus objects.
Power fractal floors and walls here and the vase is finally glass.
Gonna see if I can find an example of that translucency distance distribution....
Looking really good. I find when placing a light I make it's size large enough to see the bounding box, move it near where I want it and rhen I Right click in the 3D preview Center on object>Light source* and the scene zooms to Light source * which when selected becomes the temporary rotational center and the light is more easily positioned from there. Then just click the Current render camera button and you're back to your scene and resize your light to what you had it.
Quote from: bobbystahr on February 07, 2017, 12:26:36 AM
Looking really good. I find when placing a light I make it's size large enough to see the bounding box, move it near where I want it and rhen I Right click in the 3D preview Center on object>Light source* and the scene zooms to Light source * which when selected becomes the temporary rotational center and the light is more easily positioned from there. Then just click the Current render camera button and you're back to your scene and resize your light to what you had it.
Thank you Bobby! Something else I never knew, as I was hesitant to add additional light sources. I have one particular file I can indeed implement this.
Here I have again modified the original object file to add some clutter to the room. There are just the bare bones object shaders on now after exporting and running through Poseray.
The coordinate setup worked great. The tiny flame above the candle is a seperate object...with a magnifier you can see the flame.... Haze is light for now but after shaders should show better. Now to see if my clip files work...heh.
Sorry to bore you with this progress, but I am learning A LOT!
This is what I like, seeing the progress being made. is this TG rendering, btw, or still Blender?
Agree with Ulco, we're here as much for personal artistic growth as anything and watching someone grok stuff thru their WIPs is a treat especially when we're able to help the process along somewhat. We've all had questions answered here so it feels good to give back and in some cases pay it forward with new ideas.
Quote from: Dune on February 07, 2017, 12:14:07 PM
This is what I like, seeing the progress being made. is this TG rendering, btw, or still Blender?
Quote from: bobbystahr on February 07, 2017, 12:44:08 PM
Agree with Ulco, we're here as much for personal artistic growth as anything and watching someone grok stuff thru their WIPs is a treat especially when we're able to help the process along somewhat. We've all had questions answered here so it feels good to give back and in some cases pay it forward with new ideas.
Just prior image was TG render before applying TG shaders.
These are the tests and an almost final render.
To do:
See if I can figure out translucent for the cloth and flower petals, which both already have other shaders.
And get either red or purple grapes....heh
I finally also figured out why most of my images are so flat looking. For some reason, I have not used specular (leaving it black on most things). Now...with just adding a little, I have some on the apple, and the grapes...duh...I think this was because Blender Cycles you add all sorts of nodes for gloss and junk, so just start with no specular.
I would tone down the texture on the table cloth, or find another, more subtle one. And try to experiment with a default shader and glass shader (no reflection) merged, for some 'transluparancy'.
transluparancy
? ???
A Modern Mix of translucency and transparency ;)
Ha! Okay thanks! I knew exactly what you meant.
slickery: adj. mixture of slick and slippery....Like when it is not ice or snow, it is both and it is slickery!
What a confusement!! ;D ;D
;D
All you have to do is talk in terms I understand. ;D
Quote from: Dune on February 08, 2017, 02:23:08 AM
I would tone down the texture on the table cloth, or find another, more subtle one. And try to experiment with a default shader and glass shader (no reflection) merged, for some 'transluparancy'.
good thought Ulco...gonna try that...haven't been texture experimenting lately.
Hannes' material share
http://www.planetside.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,22695.msg229027.html#msg229027
Hannes brass oxide tgc bowl and lamp
Hannes' gold tgc candle holder
Hannes' silver tgc plate
Hannes' fleshy tgc transluparancy tulip (color adjust) ;D
Hannes' advice on flame object with haze
For Dune .....Now with a 50 million Egyptian thread count linen table cloth :)
Soft shadows diameter 2, samples 15 Sunlight 3
For BobbyStahr.....Under cabinet area light focus on bowl
Over all I'd say you got it! I like the way this has turned out. A great learning experience no doubt.
Thanks Bobby. Scene needs paint pallet and brushes and messy rags, ....lbut that is another day, haha.....sigh
Getting closer and closer. I still think the cloth isn't right, too much 'grain'. Why not try something like this? No displacement or very very little (0.001)
Quote from: Dune on February 09, 2017, 02:30:07 AM
Getting closer and closer. I still think the cloth isn't right, too much 'grain'. Why not try something like this? No displacement or very very little (0.001)
I am working on this. The cloth is of course greatly subdivided internally in Blender. I think maybe I weighted it too much using cotton setting rather than silk. This was to avoid sharpness on the table edges. The last render rather looks like wool, doesn't it? The coarseness this time is from the image multiplier being set very small. I can leave it plain, but I was still trying for a sort of older look, like the cloths all of our great, great grandma's used.
In the image below you can see where the cloth rips upon collision....at the corners of the table....another ...no..no! I perhaps did not let the animation bake long enough and it would spring back to normal in another frame, but I get impatient..ha.
Just do some post-smoothing of those corners until it doesn't poke through. Probably not enough vertices on those corners (for cloth simulation that is).
It pays to stop at the forum :)
Transluparancy?? Grabbed this hint from Hannes' curtains.
Merged and image map and a glass shader set reflect about 0.5 ran through transform input world space for the table cloth.
Vase is done with various shaders : glass, image and glass merged, image...
Hannes' image link http://www.planetside.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,22834.msg230878.html#msg230878
ok, those table clothes look pretty cool :)
:) Why thanks masonspappy.
Well done, you have a great ability to grasp stuff fairly fast....takes me longer as I get distracted and start playin' guitar during test renders and often it's an hour or so before I check and find I've forgotten wtf I was testing...LOL
Looks great!!
Told you so ;) Now if you set the opacity to 0.501 you can get a bit lighter shadows also, though still not perfect as the glass shader does throw fat shadows.