Hi All. I'm a newb. I've dabbled with the previous version, but recently got a new Intel Core I7 and thought it was time to give TG2 a go.
I hope you'll forgive me for being lazy, but at the mo I just don't have the time to hunt through the forums looking for all the hard to find tutorial stuff. I could easily spend hours and get nowhere, knowing me.
So I'd be really grateful if someone could send me a test TG2 file (heightfile plus proj file) that I can just load up and experiment with. I'm after something that looks like a mountain. I don't care about water or clever stuff. I just want a generic looking mountain with grass and a few rocks. I don't even care about snow. One or two clouds would be nice.
Can anyone send me something like that? It would be mega useful, and I hope you'll understand why I've turned to you experts before trying to figure out everything for myself. If I had time I would have a go, but thought it would be better if an expert could just send me a zip file all ready to load and go. What d'you think? Or if anyone has a link already to a 'generic mountain' then I'd love to see it! Thanks a million
http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?board=2.0
http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?board=14.0
Thank you for these links, which as far as I can tell are just branches off the main discussion forums page, which I found earlier.
As I suspected I've wasted a couple of hours hunting through them, yes there are some tg2 examples but none seem to be what I'm looking for. Partly this is because the thread titles often don't give much away.
Short of forcing me to look through every post and open every file, I was hoping an experienced user might be able to just send me a .tgd (I know now that's what I'm after) which a generic type mountain that I can just press render and see how it turns out.
Is this possible? Many thanks to anyone willing to help me.
Hi,
Perhaps you could try out Luc Bianco's Canyon pack?
http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=5659.0
EDIT: Just realized that the link to the actual page where you can get it is down :( Sorry about that...
Sorry, not into canyons!
In fact, I can already make terrains in 0.9. I just need someone to show how to make shaders to produce a passable surface that looks like a mountain. Thanks anyway though.
http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=2747.0
You'll just need to learn like everyone else here - practice. There are multiple files and some very good tutorials all around.
Thank you. The Barren world tutorial looks great, but I don't need to render a planet. Just a mountain.
Is it really the case that new users can't do anything with this software until they've put in hard graft? Hours of practice etc? Is Terragen a private members' club? Is there no merit in making life a bit easier for new users, or is there some rite of passage into the Terragen User clique?
My feeling is that if they want to sell more copies, they've got to provide some decent files to help get people started. If there is a mountain tutorial please let me know.
I do not believe all new users should waste countless cumulative man hours trying to find the same poorly indexed tutorials. There should be a well organised page on how to get started, inlcuding sample files to mess around with. Most software I've used comes with official tutorial data and getting started guides. Terragen doesn't seem to, which is why I turned to the forums for help. If anyone else feels they can send me a sample file I'd really be ever so grateful. If you do, I guess in future I might be able to help other newbs down the line.
If it makes you feel any better, in the next day or so the final release of TG2 is due to come out and it is going to have with it Full Documentation. However you would have had to pre-purchase to get the update. I think you can still pre-purchase at Planetside's website
http://www.planetside.co.uk/terragen/tg2/prepurchase_tg2.shtml (http://www.planetside.co.uk/terragen/tg2/prepurchase_tg2.shtml)
There are plenty of sample files in the file sharing section as calico pointed out. If you just take the time to search for things you should find them. If you don't have time to search or to experiment with TG then I don't know what to tell you?
Not sure about your experience with 3D software, but TG2 is not unlike other 3D packages - it takes some learning to be able to create something decent. This is a pretty common experience. TG .9 doesn't fit into the same category as TG2 and will require a level of commitment on your part to grasp it and use it in a creative way, just as Buzzzzz pointed out by directing you to purchasing the full version at a dissipating discount price.
Quote from: jt256 on March 30, 2009, 07:55:35 AM
Is it really the case that new users can't do anything with this software until they've put in hard graft? Hours of practice etc?
OK thanks - good points.
When I need to fine tune creative settings then, sure, I'll need a good understanding of how it works.
But in the meantime I just want to render a mountain to see what can be done. I don't care about sky/rock/shader settings, just as long as it looks vaguely real.
I see on the TG2 gallery loads of examples up my street, but I've yet to find the associated files. Can someone not just send me an example? That's really all I'm after. I don't need fine creative control right now, I just want to get a head start and use someone else's file. Please?
Quote from: jt256 on March 30, 2009, 09:21:39 AM
OK thanks - good points.
When I need to fine tune creative settings then, sure, I'll need a good understanding of how it works.
But in the meantime I just want to render a mountain to see what can be done. I don't care about sky/rock/shader settings, just as long as it looks vaguely real.
I see on the TG2 gallery loads of examples up my street, but I've yet to find the associated files. Can someone not just send me an example? That's really all I'm after. I don't need fine creative control right now, I just want to get a head start and use someone else's file. Please?
Here, Oshyan took the time to write this tutorial http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=19 (http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=19) I suggest you read it and when finished you will be able to make a mountain. Not to be mean or anything, but if you don't want to read then perhaps TG2 is not for you. I would try Bryce or Vue because the learning curve is much easier and Vue comes with sample scenes. However you may still need to do a little reading?
The three great essentials to achieve anything worth while are: Hard work, Stick-to-itiveness, and Common sense. Edison, Thomas A.
That's a helpful tutorial. But again, I'm really struggling with the attitude that a new user must start at the very beginning before he or she can even begin to think about making decent renders. This attitude suggests that only after a period of weeks/months/years can a user expect to make decent scenes. With so many parameters to choose from, it's inevitable that those of us starting out are going to make crap renders at first. And perhaps if we apply ourselves over the next six months perhaps we'll be able to do better.
What an astonishingly patronising attitude.
I don't want to learn shaders from the ground up. I want someone to say, look, try this file. I've adjusted all the little tweaks that you didn't even know existed, and the result is really good. Try it out for yourself.
Why am I being denied the assistance of other more experienced users? Why can't someone just say "here you go, these are the settings to make decent mountains." I'm not going to exploit someone else's copyright, I'm not going to make money from someone else's hard work. I just totally reject the notion that because I don't know much about TG2 I'm ineligible to receive the help I'm after. I just want to see how an expert would do it.
If you're an expert and you're considering telling me to clear off until I've understood the manual, please stop to consider how patronising that is. It's a bit like Microsoft saying 'no we're not going to show you how to use those really useful features until you've proved that you understand the whole of our product'. Right now I'm in a hurry, I don't want to learn TG2 from ground up, I just want the settings to render some nice mountains. Why can noone help me?
JT, I think people are a little non-plussed by your request because generating a mountain is so simple - *if you know what to do*,, which is, when you open the default scene, you'll see that the "Terrain" tab is open, and in the list below, you can see "Heightfield shader 01" with a plus sign beside it. Click on the plus sign, and "Heightfield generate 01" appears indented below. Click on this, and then below you'll see a whole bunch of settings appear. The one you want is "Generate now" (tick "Auto generate" if you want it to reappear every time you re-open the file). Et voila, there is your mountain.
I've attached a basic file with mountains ("Auto generate" is ticked) , grass, snow and fake stones (created in the "Shaders" tab), for you to play with.
You've been given a lot of help and I'm beginning to wonder how old you are. You are beginning to sound like you're whining...not a good sign, if you actually want to learn something.
Quote from: jt256 on March 30, 2009, 10:38:06 AM
Why can no one help me?
Quote from: domdib on March 30, 2009, 10:43:10 AM
JT, I think people are a little non-plussed by your request because generating a mountain is so simple - *if you know what to do*,, which is, when you open the default scene, you'll see that the "Terrain" tab is open, and in the list below, you can see "Heightfield shader 01" with a plus sign beside it. Click on the plus sign, and "Heightfield generate 01" appears indented below. Click on this, and then below you'll see a whole bunch of settings appear. The one you want is "Generate now" (tick "Auto generate" if you want it to reappear every time you re-open the file). Et voila, there is your mountain.
I've attached a basic file with mountains ("Auto generate" is ticked) , grass, snow and fake stones (created in the "Shaders" tab), for you to play with.
Well I'll be damned, he grabbed your file, took off and didn't even say "Thank You".
Quote from: jt256 on March 30, 2009, 10:38:06 AM
That's a helpful tutorial. But again, I'm really struggling with the attitude that a new user must start at the very beginning before he or she can even begin to think about making decent renders. This attitude suggests that only after a period of weeks/months/years can a user expect to make decent scenes. With so many parameters to choose from, it's inevitable that those of us starting out are going to make crap renders at first. And perhaps if we apply ourselves over the next six months perhaps we'll be able to do better.
What an astonishingly patronising attitude.
I don't want to learn shaders from the ground up. I want someone to say, look, try this file. I've adjusted all the little tweaks that you didn't even know existed, and the result is really good. Try it out for yourself.
Why am I being denied the assistance of other more experienced users? Why can't someone just say "here you go, these are the settings to make decent mountains." I'm not going to exploit someone else's copyright, I'm not going to make money from someone else's hard work. I just totally reject the notion that because I don't know much about TG2 I'm ineligible to receive the help I'm after. I just want to see how an expert would do it.
If you're an expert and you're considering telling me to clear off until I've understood the manual, please stop to consider how patronising that is. It's a bit like Microsoft saying 'no we're not going to show you how to use those really useful features until you've proved that you understand the whole of our product'. Right now I'm in a hurry, I don't want to learn TG2 from ground up, I just want the settings to render some nice mountains. Why can noone help me?
You can call me Patronizing if you like. What
I find astonishing is that you don't seem to want to read a simple tutorial on making your first scene? The impression I get from your attitude is you are spoiled kid who has had everything handed to them on a silver platter. Well guess what? Mommy and Daddy don't seem to be on this forum.
Wow, getting pretty bitchy here.
Thanks for the file (now that I've had a chance to look at it). I'm sorry I didn't thank you the second I downloaded it, as that seems to have caused some offence. I hope you'll forgive my 30 minute interlude.
Do any files exist for any images in the TG2 gallery? http://www.planetside.co.uk/gallery/f/tg2 (http://www.planetside.co.uk/gallery/f/tg2)
I appreciate that I'm the minority here, but it seems that unless Terragen gets an awful lot more user friendly, along with high quality examples, it will remain a minority tool for a few highly experienced individuals. I suspect some people like it that way. But I think the program has tremendous appeal, and it would be a pity were it relegated only to those in the know.
sorry if i jump in guys...
but I don't get the point here : you don't want to "lose" time on reading and learning but you want some more advanced users to "lose" time on creating a mountain and send the tgd to you ?! :o
TG2 is not a "private member's club", but your attitude might go against you. You want a file, without trying to even understand the basics and when someone points tutorial to you, you say you don't want to learn from the basic but get a file from an "expert" and try to understand how it works...
let me tell you that you don't have a pleasant attitude, and that if someone upload an "expert" file of a mountain, i am pretty sure you won't understand anything.
you want this file, quickly, you're in a hurry, you want it now but not for commercial purpose (of couuurse)... well... and when people don't send you the tgd right now, you start your critics about the community ? let me say that i learned TG2 with those guys, and it was fun because everybody tries to help... but if you act like a child, you'll be considered as a child...
The only thing i agree with is that the forum should have a "beginner" place where every simple tuto and simple files can be found... well there isn't such place, so you'll have to read and learn the basics... like everybody does !
I would like to learn Maya or 3DSMax, but I want to do great renders right now, without reading, without trying to understand the basics... impossible ! same for TG2...
Maybe someone will send you a great tgd... i won't ! >:(
you have bad attitude and i don't like it ... sorry ^^
but... if you try to do something, after reading at least one basic tutorial, and post it on the forum, i will give you some advices and help you to achieve something better than your first render...
sorry if i sound mean but... well... TG2's community is certainly the best i met and i don't like people we don't even know coming in here to spit on our attitude.
I think this might show your experience with 3D. It's difficult to know you, really, but from what I've seen is Planetside is one of the easiest places to learn a software package I've ever witnessed and I've seen a lot of software development from inside and out. But, your assumption that this is a tough piece of software is moot - look at all of the files and tutorials available here. All you need to do is use the Search function.
The reality is that you actually need to learn something to use TG2 (no brainless zombies here) and that all of the links I gave to you to check out could get you going in about 30 minutes time, which is less than the time we've taken here in this thread.
You could have already had the satisfaction of creating your own mountain.
Quote from: jt256 on March 30, 2009, 11:30:14 AM
I appreciate that I'm the minority here, but it seems that unless Terragen gets an awful lot more user friendly, along with high quality examples, it will remain a minority tool for a few highly experienced individuals. I suspect some people like it that way. But I think the program has tremendous appeal, and it would be a pity were it relegated only to those in the know.
Buzzz1 you are exactly right. I don't want to read a tutorial. I don't even want to make 'my first scene'. As I've stated, I'm not interested in becoming a new terragen hobbyist, starting from scratch etc.
I just want to see how others made their scenes. Then I want to make a few changes. The quickest way to do that is to get someone else's files. I'd expect such files to be easily on offer on the homepage. Seth I don't want others to lose time making bespoke mountain scenes; but if they have them already, wouldn't it be nice to share them somewhere?
Self sufficiency is great, but in this instance I want the QUICKEST way to render some mountains. If that's on a silver platter then great. The problem is that some of you have a problem with spoon feeding me. If this were a college course in how to use Terragen, then you'd expect me to take more initiative and learn it myself. But it ain't. As I've explained, I'm in a hurry to get some mountains, and I have no problem taking the lazy approach.
Put it this way: the harder you guys make it for people to get into TG, the fewer copies will be sold, and that's ultimately to the detriment of future development.
troll ?
you need a file ? i need 1500€... do we have a deal ?
we help people to learn TG2, but you don't want to learn it... so why do we have to help you ? just because you ask ?
I don't speak for everybody but I shared a lot of tgd in here !!! so i really don't understand your bad attitude... you don't even want to spend some time on the search tab... and read a tutorial...
anyway, maybe you'll find someone to help you in here.
I'd say your gripe should be with Planetside not with it's users. We are here to learn, not to sell TG.
What a thoroughly nice person....
;D
I was deciding to weight in or not. while I have received some private help from you guys. I have also found a lot of information while searching the forums, downloading tgc and tgd files and of the excellent tutorials from Seth, Volker, Frankb et all. and while t2 goes have some snap in qualities it take time to understand it. some like this topics author is not going to spend the time learning if everything is given. This software is not cut and paste. Each layer can be as detailed as you want it. I have been spending hours lately with the fake stone shader, trying to get the shapes and sizes I want. to that end I have found discussions, and files that have pointed me in the right direction. If everyone gave nothing else out. there is still so much information in the archives, i would still be satisfied. and my thanks to all who have so generously shared their knowledge and time
btw - I am now a fully registered user
folder
Quote from: folder on March 30, 2009, 01:03:00 PM
I am now a fully registered user
woooohooooo !!! :D
Great! Welcome to the Planetside community. As far as getting stuff done, if you continue to run into issues or challenges with the Fake Stones, some here can probably answer your questions or search until we find something.
Quote from: folder on March 30, 2009, 01:03:00 PM
I was deciding to weight in or not. while I have received some private help from you guys. I have also found a lot of information while searching the forums, downloading tgc and tgd files and of the excellent tutorials from Seth, Volker, Frankb et all. and while t2 goes have some snap in qualities it take time to understand it. some like this topics author is not going to spend the time learning if everything is given. This software is not cut and paste. Each layer can be as detailed as you want it. I have been spending hours lately with the fake stone shader, trying to get the shapes and sizes I want. to that end I have found discussions, and files that have pointed me in the right direction. If everyone gave nothing else out. there is still so much information in the archives, i would still be satisfied. and my thanks to all who have so generously shared their knowledge and time
btw - I am now a fully registered user
folder
Well then, here's my mountain. I don't think there's anything too difficult for me to tweak without fully understanding the background. It's not a jet engine after all.
And it's a darn sight better than the amateurish mountains that some of you would have preferred me to slave over.
@jt256 - Did you create it yourself? If so, it's pretty good. If you used someone else's file, what did you learn?
Daring to enter into this quickly...I think I understand what you are wanting. That is, you want a finished, realistic scene which you can then alter settings and get equally good results. Now, while I don't think there is anything particular evil in this desire (after all, who doesn't want to go straight to top of the quality ladder) there are some things you should keep in mind. The "realistic" images you see in the gallery were -- at least for the most part -- created by people who put A LOT of time (days, weeks, months, years) and trial and error into learning what shaders do and don't do while creating new techiques to achieve realism goals -- no to mention just getting an all around feel for the program. They have a lot invested in the level of specialty they have achieved, so don't be to quick to hold it against them if they don't just hand it over for nothing.
Quote from: jt256 on March 30, 2009, 01:28:31 PM
And it's a darn sight better than the amateurish mountains that some of you would have preferred me to slave over.
hahaha
::)
agree with nvseal... he explain my point of view with clear and quiet terms ;)
QuoteI'm in a hurry to get some mountains
I was just thinking... With that attitude, you aren't going to get
anything of mine, or anyone elses in here... I think you've managed to get your hands on a version of my grass though, by the looks of it. Did you learn anything useful from it?
Quote from: calico on March 30, 2009, 11:39:29 AMThe reality is that you actually need to learn something to use TG2 (no brainless zombies here) ...
Well maybe one - I'm still here. ;)
Quote from: calico on March 30, 2009, 01:53:02 PM@jt256 - Did you create it yourself? If so, it's pretty good. If you used someone else's file, what did you learn?
Something tells me that mountain he showed wasn't generated by him. Too many details for someone with that attitude to come up with in that time-frame. Rome wasn't built in a day. This is like that old "teach-a-man-to-fish" story. Or the other version that I like even more... ...build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day... ...but set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. 8)
Quote from: jt256 on March 30, 2009, 07:55:35 AMIf anyone else feels they can send me a sample file I'd really be ever so grateful. If you do, I guess in future I might be able to help other newbs down the line.
I don't like to be cynical, but I'm not going to hold my breath on that one. :-\
Quote from: chromecity on March 30, 2009, 03:16:40 PM
build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day... ...but set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. 8)
Still not very long though... ;D
Having just read this whole thread (pretty long fur such a short time), I'm curious.
JT, what do you want to do? What is your goal? Do you need the mountain for something, are you working on a project? If not, why want a TG mountain scene, but don't want to learn the software or anything? Or is this the best way for you to learn stuff? That last one could be a good possibility.
The problem is mostly that you didn't explain your intentions, and people are a bit suspicious lately, because of some stuff with other members.
If you just wanted to show others (like friends or parents or whatever) what a great mountain you made with this software, it wouldn't be nice to showoff the work of others as their own. I wouldn't like to give you the work I'm most proud of just so you can take credit for it...
But if you wanted to test the software, or your pc or something, that would be fine of course.
So please, tell us what your goal is so we can help you in the best way possible, ánd understand it.
While I can't say I really understand or agree with this approach to scene building, I do find the idea that there aren't many easily found resources to be a bit surprising. First of all the File Sharing section is chock full of the building blocks of scenes, or even whole scenes in some cases, usually with image examples, etc. Few people do share their entire scenes, but even those can be had, for free in some cases as in the Terragen.org file library www.terragen.org. High quality "drop-in" scene elements can also be hard for a small charge as in Frank Basinski's growing library of store items: http://nwda.webnode.com/terragen-2-tech-packs/
In the end I'm not sure what is to be gained by slightly tweaking someone else's file. Inevitably there is a lot to learn to get the best results, as with any reasonably capable 3D program.
- Oshyan
No offense but why not just take the time to learn tg2 a little? Making a decent mountain scene isn't that hard, and those "my first scene's" often take only 2-3 hours to do if that, while teaching quite a lot. The learning curve on TG2 is very small compared to most other software, but not as quick as .9. With tons of new features comes quite a bit more learning what everything is/does/works. And browsing around the forums often has tutorials on how to do little somethings, piece it together and you get something cool. Dandelo's library's are very nice and have taught me a little with the node networks as those still confuse me.
Knowledge doesn't come easy, and these forums are more then willing to help people learn how to do things, but to just hand them straight over you'll hit some resistance as so much help is already available if you just spent some time.
There are certainly many egotistical ingrates in this world. It was very rude of jt256 to hit and run and not even say thank you, especially when the sample that domdib provided was so good. I hope this doesn't deter all you other providers of assistance from submitting help for "lurkers" like me.
Cheers,
Norm.
Let's go easy on him. :) Hopefully he's got what he needs and will be back with more in-depth questions!
- Oshyan
My thoughts exactly...