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General => Open Discussion => Topic started by: JohnnyBoy on June 17, 2007, 01:41:31 pm

Title: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: JohnnyBoy on June 17, 2007, 01:41:31 pm
I just noticed this on another site and thought the five or six people ;) who use XSI here would find it useful. There is a free version for non-commercial use that is pretty powerful.

http://www.simartom.com/
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: cyphyr on June 17, 2007, 03:11:34 pm
Looks impressive  ~  if you've got XSI
richard
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 18, 2007, 01:00:13 pm
I've thought about going to XSI a number of times.  But, aren't these applications all the same?  Lightwave, XSI, MAX...  Any opinions?  I'm curious what people on this site think about the general application packages like these three listed here and others, if you have a strong opinion and some experience with anything else.
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: JohnnyBoy on June 18, 2007, 05:41:07 pm
Calico, be careful or you might start a flame war. :( Basically everyone will tell you to use whatever they are using.
I'll try to give you my view of the apps.

3DSMax - Positives: It has everything but the kitchen sink - very powerful. Dominant in the games industry.
              Negatives: Sort of feels like your using twenty different apps, poorly designed. Expensive $3000+
Maya - Positives: I enjoyed using Maya, better design than Max, but still has just about everything. Dominant in the movies.
          Negatives: Could have a more coherent design, expensive $2500+  ??
XSI - Positives: The best design of any 3d application I have ever used, great animation ability and works well with other apps.          The $500 Foundation version is a steal.
        Negatives: Lack of plugins, smaller user base, lack of tutorials, and the particle system isn't the best.
Blender - A poor man's 3dsMax, many features but feels like 50 different apps. It's Free!
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 19, 2007, 11:09:39 am
JohnnyBoy, thanks!  This is more than I asked for, but wonderful.  I believe XSI sounds like something I'd like to learn, but have been "sticking it out" trying to learn Lightwave.  3DSMax seems like a well liked application and I just can't bring myself to pay that much yet.  Without a return, what's the point, unless we have a strong urge (and extra money) to just be creative.  Of course, I want to be creative, but I've tried Maya, LW, and a Max demo.  I liked the Max demo the best, but am curious about trying XSI.

I'm not worried about flame wars.  Just objective observations, if anyone is willing.   :D

Thanks again, JohnnyBoy.
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: BPauba on June 19, 2007, 02:19:55 pm
Quote from: calico on June 19, 2007, 11:09:39 am
JohnnyBoy, thanks!  This is more than I asked for, but wonderful.  I believe XSI sounds like something I'd like to learn, but have been "sticking it out" trying to learn Lightwave.  3DSMax seems like a well liked application and I just can't bring myself to pay that much yet.  Without a return, what's the point, unless we have a strong urge (and extra money) to just be creative.  Of course, I want to be creative, but I've tried Maya, LW, and a Max demo.  I liked the Max demo the best, but am curious about trying XSI.

I'm not worried about flame wars.  Just objective observations, if anyone is willing.   :D

Thanks again, JohnnyBoy.


www.luxology.com
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 19, 2007, 02:45:16 pm
Wow, BPauba, that looks impressive.  Have you tried it?  If so, how easy is it to learn?  What's your opinion?
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Will on June 19, 2007, 02:54:14 pm
Its a good program, havent used it much myself though. Also to add to your numinous choices for doing various things I'll add Zbrush and Mudbox into the mix. They are high poly organic modelers that try to make it easy to "sculpt" your model using an almost clay like system. I haven't used Mudbox much outside the demo but it has a great UI and nice features. I most ly use Zbrush myself wand I like it, the UI has a semi-steep learning curve but their is a lot power behind it if you get use to it. In the end it all just comes down to what you work more naturally with.

Regards,

Will
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 19, 2007, 02:58:10 pm
Will, thanks.  I wonder what that means as I try various software and sometimes it isn't possible to try a package.  In cases where a demo doesn't exist, I think the company is just hurting themselves.  I've thought about ZBrush and then thought about the learning curve (time, mostly) and wonder what I would do with it once I began using it.  That's another area of discussion, isn't it - what to do with all of this?
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Will on June 19, 2007, 03:01:55 pm
Blender has sculpting ability's now though you may want to try it.

Regards,

Will
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Moose on June 19, 2007, 03:38:05 pm
Quote from: calico on June 19, 2007, 02:58:10 pm
I've thought about ZBrush and then thought about the learning curve (time, mostly) and wonder what I would do with it once I began using it.


Yeah ZBrush is pretty cool, inspite of it still doing everything it's way. The learning curve isn't so bad - just have to accept it's different and then get one of those Intro DVDs from Digital Tutors or Gnomon (now also Gnomonology) to fast-track things a bit. Tallent is another matter though :o. As to what to do with it in a TG2 context, well you could sculpt displacement maps for close-up land forms or hero objects like rocks, tree's, walls etc. There's now a 1 billion poly limit for objects in ZB so the detail should be pretty amazing when close-up (Exporting this detail as a disp map is still an unknown factor atm however, as Pixologic still have to release the plugin to make it all possible).

Another general-purpose app worth adding to your investigation list is Houdini. There's the free Apprentice edition of it - http://www.sidefx.com/index.php?option=com_download&task=apprentice&Itemid=89 - that you can use to learn on. It has few restrictions and is available to use indefinately. If you are interested I'd wait until after they release the next version (anytime now really, but definitely by Siggraph) as there is set to be a major UI and workflow revamp that is said to make it more artist-friendly. :)
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Will on June 19, 2007, 03:44:58 pm
Yea hopefully Zmapper for 3.0 will come out soon. Houdini is a nice app, worth looking into. Though we will all have to wait till TG can handle all this.

Regards,

Will
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 19, 2007, 04:07:52 pm
Thanks Moose.  I've added Houdini to programs to try.
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: BPauba on June 19, 2007, 04:22:36 pm
Quote from: calico on June 19, 2007, 02:45:16 pm
Wow, BPauba, that looks impressive.  Have you tried it?  If so, how easy is it to learn?  What's your opinion?

Oh buddy. I myself am looking for a modeling program and I have gone through alot of them. I was informed about modo by an old buddy, and I decided to try the trial version. (which is 30 days no limitation). Twas amazing. I did not have much time with the trial version due to vacation :D, but what I learned in the short 2 day span was amazing.
http://img523.imageshack.us/my.php?image=05ss5.jpg
Now I know that is not a complex or astonishing model/render, but I feel its pretty good for my first render in the program! modo is so intuitive and so hands on. You will love it. I have to admit that I am not a 3d guy by any means. I am fluent in CAD and a couple of specialty programs such as inventor, but by no means do i know my way around a true 3d program (just to put my knowledge into context).
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 19, 2007, 05:29:36 pm
BPauba,

Cool.  I think this might be valuable, since it can do a lot of different things.  I downloaded it and will get it going in the next few days.

I like the bowl.  Looks well formed and has a great texture.  Did you control what the texture looked like?
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: BPauba on June 19, 2007, 06:28:33 pm
Quote from: calico on June 19, 2007, 05:29:36 pm
BPauba,

Cool.  I think this might be valuable, since it can do a lot of different things.  I downloaded it and will get it going in the next few days.

I like the bowl.  Looks well formed and has a great texture.  Did you control what the texture looked like?


Yeah yeah, all made within modo as well :D.
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: JohnnyBoy on June 19, 2007, 06:50:22 pm
If all you need is a modeling program you might want to check out Silo 2.0.

http://www.nevercenter.com/

I love it!
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 20, 2007, 10:49:11 am
Is it just me or is Modo really so easy to use and just as powerful as Lightwave's modeler?  Please feel free to tell me what you think, if my ignorance is getting the best of me.

JohnnyBoy, I'll look into Silo as well.  I've played around with Silo 1.0 before.
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 21, 2007, 02:19:09 pm
http://www.splutterfish.com/sf/WebContent/Index

Wow.
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Will on June 21, 2007, 02:56:38 pm
I never used Brazil that much so I coun't tell you much about it.
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Oshyan on June 21, 2007, 03:16:38 pm
Brazil is a renderer only. Personally I'd go for Vray if I was looking at a nice 3rd party rendering solution. But regardless it's not going to help you with modeling or scene setup. Most of the renderers that come with applications like Maya, C4D, XSI, etc. are going to be fine for general needs anyway. No need to purchase a separate dedicated renderer until you at least have the basic modeling and scene editing tools in place.

- Oshyan
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Will on June 21, 2007, 03:24:05 pm
Mentalray comes native with XSI
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Oshyan on June 21, 2007, 03:27:02 pm
Mental Ray comes native with most major packages these days - XSI, Maya, 3DS Max...

- Oshyan
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Will on June 21, 2007, 03:40:35 pm
true, I was just saying it to further the point of not really needing to buy a 3rd party render.

regards,

Will
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 21, 2007, 04:10:53 pm
Yeah, I understand.  Thanks for the comments.  I still think Splutterfish renders are awesome.

Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: Will on June 21, 2007, 04:33:34 pm
But remember it comes down to the artist now the tool to create something great.
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 22, 2007, 08:56:21 am
You're right, Will.  It's so easy to jump on a tool due to someone's inspirational creativity. 

Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: cyphyr on June 26, 2007, 03:22:45 pm
Head over to CGTALK (www.cgtalk.com (http://www.cgtalk.com)) for chat about all the major modeling apps. Its a forum of professional and hobbyists who freely share ideas and opinions of all things 3d related. Its also free. Great community, much like this one. ;)

Richard
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: JohnnyBoy on June 26, 2007, 04:08:53 pm
CGTalk is the best CG site on the net and a great resource. But, they no longer allow software comparisons.  :)
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 26, 2007, 07:43:50 pm
Well, I can trust this audience pretty well about TG2 and what it can / cannot do.  So, I'll ask this question here - Is Modo a good / great / lousy package to export an object for importing it (as a Wavefront object) into TG2?  I know Lightwave and Maya and 3DS|Max all seem reliable in some way or another, but what about Modo?  Any experience or any insights?
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: cyphyr on June 27, 2007, 08:48:26 am
Modo's basic engine is the same as Lightwave's (NT dev team ~ politics happened ~ team split etc..) There are so many file format conversion utilities out there now that the initial modeling package makes little difference. Many packages are available in a limited demo form ... try them out ... see which one feels best to you. I personally use Lightwave simply because the interface uses no icons, its just buttons with text on them saying what the button dose. Also as I said earlier, this stuff is v. complex, I dont have time to learn multiple packages.

Although CGTALK wont allow direct comparisons of software (too many flame wars ~ it got soo boring) you will within the various software specific sub-forums and in the gallery sections get a very good idea of the different softwares abilities and shortfalls.

Ultimately, as has been said before, its down to you and your personal needs. If, for example, the end goal is to produce models that can be used within TG2 rather than to complement TG2 into a full production sweet you may find that less fully featured software suites your needs better.

Quote from: calico on June 26, 2007, 07:43:50 pm
Is Modo a good / great / lousy package to export an object for importing it (as a Wavefront object) into TG2?


To answer your question. Yes Modo is great, but not necessarily better than any of the other top end packages.

Happy rendering~modeling

Richard
Title: Re: T-Gen new tree/plant generator for XSI
Post by: rcallicotte on June 27, 2007, 09:06:58 am
Thanks, Richard.  I understand about complexity.  I've tried various packages for over a couple of years (demos mostly) and it can be mind boggling to try to figure out what does what better.  Thanks again.