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General => Open Discussion => Topic started by: rcallicotte on June 27, 2007, 03:19:07 pm

Title: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 27, 2007, 03:19:07 pm
Is it safe to assume there will be no zBrush 3 demo any time soon?
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 27, 2007, 03:23:14 pm
pretty safe bet, but I have it and can answer some of the questions you may have. Though I know there is a mudbox demo.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 27, 2007, 03:29:34 pm
Two questions -

1.  Is zBrush 3's interface easy?
2.  Is zBrush used mostly for creating characters or does it lend itself to creating architecture and vehicles just as well?



Quote from: Will on June 27, 2007, 03:23:14 pm
pretty safe bet, but I have it and can answer some of the questions you may have. Though I know there is a mudbox demo.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 27, 2007, 03:41:24 pm
1. Its interface can have a steep learning curve for most, its powerful and customizable but it takes a lot of practice and patience to pick up. Mudbox has a better interface (though I don't like it that much)
2. You can make vehicles and architecture-but it will be pretty difficult, a new user such as yourself might find it pretty frustrating.

I would recommend trying to find a demo of Zbrush 2 and try that out, it interface is nearly exactly the same thing.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 27, 2007, 03:45:01 pm
Thanks Will!  This is very helpful.   ;D

Quote from: Will on June 27, 2007, 03:41:24 pm
1. Its interface can have a steep learning curve for most, its powerful and customizable but it takes a lot of practice and patience to pick up. Mudbox has a better interface (though I don't like it that much)
2. You can make vehicles and architecture-but it will be pretty difficult, a new user such as yourself might find it pretty frustrating.

I would recommend trying to find a demo of Zbrush 2 and try that out, it interface is nearly exactly the same thing.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 27, 2007, 03:49:22 pm
No problem, If you get any ore feel free to ask :)
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Moose on June 27, 2007, 04:14:15 pm
Not that it's any consolation for not being able to try a demo version first hand, but have you seen martin Krol's timelapse video yet - http://www.zbrushcentral.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=045693 - it might shed some light and give you a flavour of Z3.

I also see that a user is selling (legitimately) their copy of Z3 for a discounted price on ebay... assuming you're thinking of buying sometime soon - http://www.zbrushcentral.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=47851

:)
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 27, 2007, 04:38:38 pm
To expand a little, I read a article in one of the latest issues of 3dworld about doing architecture and it came with two pillars that you can merge together this is the result.


Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: efflux on June 27, 2007, 05:06:18 pm
ZBrush 3 is absolutely awesome in my opinion. I remember trying ZBrush ages ago but never got around it because I didn't use any type of modeling apps that much before hand. The ZBrush UI is not so straightforward. The UI in ZBrush 3 seems quite logical to me but many people complain. However the sculpting is simply stunning. Even the realtime preview is amazing. Massive poly counts. I love the Z Spheres and you can retopoligize meshes - if that's a new feature. I have a feeling this will become my favorite app soon. I never Tried Mudbox so can't compare.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 27, 2007, 05:51:56 pm
Quote from: Moose on June 27, 2007, 04:14:15 pm
I also see that a user is selling (legitimately) their copy of Z3 for a discounted price on ebay... assuming you're thinking of buying sometime soon - http://www.zbrushcentral.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=47851


Not sure if that will give you the free upgrade though.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 27, 2007, 06:21:42 pm
...this is zBrush?

Quote from: Will on June 27, 2007, 04:38:38 pm
To expand a little, I read a article in one of the latest issues of 3dworld about doing architecture and it came with two pillars that you can merge together this is the result.


Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 27, 2007, 06:24:28 pm
Wow.  Thank you all very much.  I'm much more interested in an application to model non-human objects, though zBrush is tugging at me.  Nevertheless, I think zBrush is more for creating creatures, human or otherwise.  If someone believes I'm wrong about that, let me know.  I'm looking at a few other programs, too - Modo, Hexagon 2.2 (I got it for free at DAZ), Mudbox, XSI...and anything that seems to fit in this crowd.   :P
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: JohnnyBoy on June 27, 2007, 07:04:52 pm
Calico, I would spend your money on a traditional modeling app before buying ZBrush/Mudbox. I did it the other way because ZBrush was "tugging at me" and regretted it until I bought XSI a month later. Really, ZBrush is great at adding high-poly details to a base-mesh created in another program. If you can't create a model in another app you are stuck with Zspheres in ZBrush and they are best for creating organic shapes. Later.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 27, 2007, 07:38:53 pm
JohnnyBoy has a very good point, XSI has a good UI and it might be a good match, blender is free, and there is bunch of stuff over at DAZ which you have already found.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: efflux on June 27, 2007, 08:22:36 pm
I agree that jumping into ZBrush is not such a good option if you want to create various types of models. If you really know that you want to create organic stuff then ZBrush is superb but I agree with the others in that your much better off learning a few things in other modeling apps. Wings 3D is free. In my opinion this is the app to start in. It's free and is quite powerful. In might not be too much fun to begin with but if you learn that app you're set to go. It's cool to use with Blender which is also free. Then if you want to go in that direction you can buy a better modeling app or go to ZBrush. ZBrush makes more sense to me now that I've tinkered with other apps. I can see why ZBrush is so brilliant. The tools in ZBrush are set up to be like sculpting which means that doing other things could be hell. If you want to build something more technical then you want lots of precision tools. I'm no expert on ZBrush though. I just tested it out a few days ago. I will be buying ZBrush.

The main ZBrush app is actually a demo as well but activated. It's the same version. It's totally stupid for Pixologic to sell software with no demo. Do they expect people to buy this software without testing it? I say no more.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 27, 2007, 08:28:45 pm
they will with time but I think for now they are working mostly for the currently user base.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: efflux on June 27, 2007, 08:46:11 pm
Maybe the idea is that they attempt to get some people to buy the new version during the huge hype and all the amazing stuff coming out from beta testers. Maybe some people who might not buy it for various reasons if they tested it first. Otherwise a demo would be there to download. I can't see any other reason. It's some marketing ploy. It happens with lots of software. Then they push the demo out to rope more sales in. If the demo is actually the standard version with a 30 day demo time then that probably makes it easier to crack as well thus they lose initial purchases.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Moose on June 28, 2007, 04:47:12 am
Quote from: Will on June 27, 2007, 05:51:56 pm
Quote from: Moose on June 27, 2007, 04:14:15 pm
I also see that a user is selling (legitimately) their copy of Z3 for a discounted price on ebay... assuming you're thinking of buying sometime soon - http://www.zbrushcentral.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=47851


Not sure if that will give you the free upgrade though.


On the ebay site it quotes from a letter with Pixologic which states that upgrade privileges are transferred to the new owner (but yeah, if I were interested I'd be checking this out first hand with Pixologic). :)


Quote from: calico on June 27, 2007, 06:24:28 pm
Wow.  Thank you all very much.  I'm much more interested in an application to model non-human objects, though zBrush is tugging at me.  Nevertheless, I think zBrush is more for creating creatures, human or otherwise.  If someone believes I'm wrong about that, let me know.  I'm looking at a few other programs, too - Modo, Hexagon 2.2 (I got it for free at DAZ), Mudbox, XSI...and anything that seems to fit in this crowd.   :P


It really depends on what you mean when you say you want to model "non-human objects". If you mean things like cars or skyscrapers etc. then ZBrush (though capable with a bit of effort) probably isn't you're best bet. But for things like walls and crumbling buildings, hero trees, landscape features etc. something like ZBrush could prove really useful (or even preferable).

There was an article on the old (and now dead) Pixologic site about some work Luma Pictures did for Underworld using Z2 for the environments -
http://209.132.96.165/zbc/showthread.php?t=035323 - but as you can see only the movie d/l link still works... the actual article dead-links. Google cache has it though - http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:EDCkDSQ4yRAJ:www.pixologic.com/zbrush/community/interviews/luma-pictures/interview.php+"luma+pictures"+pixologic+environment&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=uk&client=firefox-a (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:EDCkDSQ4yRAJ:www.pixologic.com/zbrush/community/interviews/luma-pictures/interview.php+"luma+pictures"+pixologic+environment&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=uk&client=firefox-a) - and here are the relevant pics for the lazy :P
http://download.pixologic.com/large-images/luma-pictures/large-16.jpg
http://download.pixologic.com/large-images/luma-pictures/large-04.jpg

Ultimately, like everyone here says, you'll no doubt benefit from having a trad modeller in your toolset to augment things - couldn't you make use of Hexagon here (or don't you get on with it?), I heard it had some nice poly tools(?).

:)
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 28, 2007, 10:17:12 am
efflux, Will, and JohnnyBoy - all of these suggestions and counsel is leading me to believe that zBrush is too advanced for me right now.  And, the following pics are clearly showing me the Modo advantage - http://forums.luxology.com/discussion/forum.aspx?id=24

Moose - That was very helpful.  Not only do I better understand zBrush, I can see that I have a lot to learn before trying this program.  I can see it would be useful for me someday.  Hex2 seems pretty good and I have yet to play with it some more.  At least I own it.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: JohnnyBoy on June 28, 2007, 07:54:02 pm
Calico, one more thing, to get the most out of zbrush you should have a pen-tablet like a Wacom, I don't think zbrush is useable without one. Maybe you already have a tablet, but it's one more expense to consider.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 29, 2007, 08:27:34 am
After seeing someone do a demo in zBrush (I couldn't find a demo I could try), I've concluded that zBrush is too advanced at this stage to spend time learning it.  I've also concluded that learning so many different packages can be horrible.  Perhaps some professional training in a couple of packages is what I need.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 29, 2007, 08:35:09 am
http://www.thegnomonworkshop.com/  ;)
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 29, 2007, 08:42:53 am
Will, do you like this site?  Do you recommend it?


Quote from: Will on June 29, 2007, 08:35:09 am
http://www.thegnomonworkshop.com/  ;)
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: Will on June 29, 2007, 09:06:10 am
They have good tutorials for sale from industry professionals. I've been satisfied with the one that I own. Just a recommendation.
Title: Re: zBrush 3
Post by: rcallicotte on June 29, 2007, 09:16:20 am
cool.  Thanks.  I'm checking into it right now.

Quote from: Will on June 29, 2007, 09:06:10 am
They have good tutorials for sale from industry professionals. I've been satisfied with the one that I own. Just a recommendation.