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General => Image Sharing => Topic started by: DocCharly65 on May 07, 2015, 04:44:33 AM

Title: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 07, 2015, 04:44:33 AM
Same story as so often: I wanted to play around with some objects I found - now it's a wip for "the plan"  ;)

My weekend home:

[attach=1]

As you can see from the file-name, I'm already working on an animation... coming soon  8)
The terrain in the background will of course get a planting... and I will think abot another view outsid the wall...
House found on TF3DM, plants from XFrog and then I found many, many more models at Archive3D.net.. and I HAD TO TRY THIS:

My weekend home inside:

[attach=2]

..and even for this I have an idea for an animation... let's wait and see.

Does anybody know, how detailed I must write credits for all the model makers here in the forum?
And when I go on with my "plan-animation" - what if a model is only for educational use... is my "non profit-project" with the viper educational??
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: yossam on May 07, 2015, 06:31:57 AM
I like, outside and in.  ;D
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 07, 2015, 07:04:20 AM
Thanks yossam  :)

Much work to do.
I will change the white books (perhaps some little wooden statue instead), shrink the vase...
Important is to change the color of the guitar stand. silverlooks not good, I want it black.
Put some bottles into the rack on the right side.
Of course we need a glass for the ... who knows the bottle on the table?  ;D 8)

For later I have an idea, how to animate the TV-program...
Most important will be a camera path to the clock ... and if you remember the speed of the viper in it's animation,
you will certainly have a presumption, that the animation of the clock is a central part...  :o ...with a very loud ticking of the clock!  :o

Outside I have already rendered a test scene with animated pool-water swim rings and rubber duck ... I will need some time to convert in a videofile and upload on YouTube, but anyway it's only a test...
There will be some winebarrels, some houseplants, and some other environment...

I feel like a hard working householder at this time  ;)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 07, 2015, 07:04:54 AM
The interior looks very realistic, but what is the white line high on the wall? Looks like a broken poly edge.
I think if you don't make tons of cash, your project is pretty educational.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: yossam on May 07, 2015, 07:09:22 AM
I think the bottle on the table is supposed to be Jack Daniels (the label looks kinda like it), but the bottle is wrong, too square.  :P   I've emptied a few in my past life.............got better taste now.  ;D
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 07, 2015, 07:29:34 AM
Thanks for the hint, Dune, I asked me the same... now I'm already testing a solution... I'll let you know if it works.

Yossam, I don't really remember to the design of the bottle - it's more then ten years, when it started with a simple bet: I loose my handy, when I have a drink within 3 months and I win one if I stay hard... I won!  8) - and then I was so used to coffee and water, that I made it my life-stile  ;D
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 08, 2015, 07:41:02 AM
How a little rubberduck can liven the place up...

...and you all didn't really believe you ever get rid of my rottweiler?  ;)

 [attach=1]

At home PC is rendering the frames for 3D-Version... Could be finished @ Sunday. This time really many reflection- and glass shaders - intentionally! ;)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 08, 2015, 12:19:32 PM
Lovely room render. Did you build the room and furniture?  I like the lighting a lot and that little gallery light does the trick well on the painting; nicely implemented. Cool Les Paul as well.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 08, 2015, 12:37:56 PM
Sorry bobbystahr, but models are mostly from archive3d.net, turbosquid or TF3DM.
I have enough trouble with my old brain to keep Terragen working.

Most work is the exact placing of the models. Many of them (especially the costfree ones) are little damaged (inverted normals or missing parts).
So I spend much time to place them, change textures of parts. And in this pic it was a challenge to create the lighting.

Next steps:

Animate the clock... (I have already reduced the reflection to get this:
(Only 0.2 detail & AA for a check)

[attach=1]


Then I want app. 10 seconds just watching the seconds hand moving - then zoom back to see the whole room...

And I will need some idea how I can automatically load a new texture image on the TV screen at every frame...
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 08, 2015, 12:55:58 PM
Sorry bobbystahr, but models are mostly from archive3d.net, turbosquid or TF3DM.
I have enough trouble with my old brain to keep Terragen working.

Most work is the exact placing of the models. Many of them (especially the costfree ones) are little damaged (inverted normals or missing parts).
So I spend much time to place them, change textures of parts. And in this pic it was a challenge to create the lighting.

Next steps:

Animate the clock... (I have already reduced the reflection to get this:
(Only 0.2 detail & AA for a check)

(Attachment Link)


Then I want app. 10 seconds just watching the seconds hand moving - then zoom back to see the whole room...

And I will need some idea how I can automatically load a new texture image on the TV screen at every frame...


No apologies necessary, most of us use those sites as, like you said, coming to grips with TG3 is enough to think about for us 'non wizards' ...we can't all be Dune I guess...well done on the arranging the elements, often a *fail* point in an otherwise good scene.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 08, 2015, 01:18:19 PM
Ok, thanks.  :)

I'll try do do my best with downloaded objects as well  :)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: j meyer on May 08, 2015, 04:39:31 PM
Shouldn't there be more shadows in that room?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 09, 2015, 08:50:17 AM
Good morning j meyer.  :)

I think you mean the same as I saw? : eg. at the window frames the shadows and sunbeams seam to stop.
Until now it's a mystery to me, why the glass shader of the windows prevents sunlight to cause shadows.

If you eg. look closely to the guitar-head you can see that I managed to get slight shadows on the wall but they seem only to be from the general ambient lighting.

I didn't find out until now, how to get the sunlight "through the windows"
If it's an issue of the glass shader perhaps one of the next TG3 updates will help.


Yesterday evening I played with the clock...  I didn't like the clock face.
So on the basis of the original clock I recreated a "new" clock in Wings3D.
I deleted the 12 numbers and the 60 subdivision dashes - they were each a single object.
I also deleted the clockface because I couldn't get a UV-mapping on it and inserted the round carpet.
So now what you see is not a clock face but a carpet inside the clock glass  ;D
Hope you can friendly smile about my solution  ;)

[attach=1]

Only postwork was a little brightening and increasing gamma and contrast.



Update 11:15
An experiment: I increased the tranparency to 100 but the effect is the same: Sunbeams and shadows seem to stop at the windows...
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 09, 2015, 02:04:23 PM
Good morning j meyer.  :)

I think you mean the same as I saw? : eg. at the window frames the shadows and sunbeams seam to stop.
Until now it's a mystery to me, why the glass shader of the windows prevents sunlight to cause shadows.

If you eg. look closely to the guitar-head you can see that I managed to get slight shadows on the wall but they seem only to be from the general ambient lighting.

I didn't find out until now, how to get the sunlight "through the windows"
If it's an issue of the glass shader perhaps one of the next TG3 updates will help.


Yesterday evening I played with the clock...  I didn't like the clock face.
So on the basis of the original clock I recreated a "new" clock in Wings3D.
I deleted the 12 numbers and the 60 subdivision dashes - they were each a single object.
I also deleted the clockface because I couldn't get a UV-mapping on it and inserted the round carpet.
So now what you see is not a clock face but a carpet inside the clock glass  ;D
Hope you can friendly smile about my solution  ;)

(Attachment Link)

Only postwork was a little brightening and increasing gamma and contrast.



Update 11:15
An experiment: I increased the tranparency to 100 but the effect is the same: Sunbeams and shadows seem to stop at the windows...

j meyer and I found in some experiments that the glass needs to have cast shadows unchecked and to do that you must load all glass separately from the main object which needs them on. Also if it is not a single plane window(but has volume[front back and 4 sides]) it will need Double sided surface un checked as well.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 09, 2015, 03:08:37 PM
Oh Thanks! I'll try!
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 09, 2015, 07:22:40 PM
Oh Thanks! I'll try!

You can just dial the glass out to zero in it's Parts shader...save you having to redo the whole thing, and then load the separated glass parts as a new object.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 09, 2015, 07:56:17 PM
 ;D can you see what I am doing here on my PC? That's exactly, what I thought and did the last hours... but thanks.

I reconected the old default shader to the glass and set the opacity to zero. Rest as you said.
Renderjob 3000x1687 already running.

I'm curious how it looks in stereoscopic 3D  ;)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 09, 2015, 08:02:30 PM
;D can you see what I am doing here on my PC? That's exactly, what I thought and did the last hours... but thanks.

I reconected the old default shader to the glass and set the opacity to zero. Rest as you said.
Renderjob 3000x1687 already running.

I'm curious how it looks in stereoscopic 3D  ;)

hope you did some smaller tests...I look forward to seeing the results
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Emmeline on May 10, 2015, 08:30:36 AM
"Illegally copied in China" huh?
That made me laugh out loud.
I'm liking this render a lot. To be honest, when I saw the lack of reflection of the shadows from the windows on the right, my brain thought the sun's position was at an angle that no direct light was getting into the room itself.
Nicely done! The little duck made me smile, too.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 10, 2015, 02:38:04 PM
The "Rolleks" Copy ?  8) ;D
In office in fact I work a lot of time with chines colleagues, and they are always friendly, funny and sometimes a little stubborn... Short story: We wanted them to build a technical device and we put a little sticker on one sample, we built in Germany: "only sample - not for resale"
Some months later many costumers called us and asked: what does that sticker mean? "only sample - not for resale"... They had EXACTLY copied our sample  ;D

Besides... The new render has finished. I will change some more things before I start animation or 3D: E.g. I will delete the woman, which I cannot animate anyway. About the dog I'm not sure... fast camerapath to the clock, and he may stay there. Perhaps I will upload a special animation test as surprise tonight...

But first have a look at the now REALLY translucent windows and the revival of the missing shadows:

[attach=1]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Cocateho on May 10, 2015, 03:14:08 PM
That last close up with the clock is almost photo real. Very nice! both the clock and wooden mask look real, the wall could use something, maybe slight displacement, a little reflectivity to mimic glossy paint? For close ups anyway. Kick@$$ work!
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 10, 2015, 09:43:42 PM
You're right Cocateho.
In fact I have a displacement there but reduced until it looked like woodchip wallpaper at low detail and AA.
Unfortunately I lost that look with the high detail render. I will play with the settings...

Meanwhile I replaced the woman by some houseplants and have a first "low level" (Detail 0.3, AA 2) render:

[attach=1]

After I won a little struggle with a floating doormat... here you can see a quick render of the view from outside:

[attach=2]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 11, 2015, 03:55:46 AM
Better without the DAZ creature,...on the outside shot some mapping problems with the patio and pool edge but a nice house.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 11, 2015, 06:26:47 AM
For more realism you could add some subtle dirt. Even the cleanest living quarters aren't extremely clean, IMO.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 11, 2015, 06:45:07 AM
Good idea, Dune. I eg. already thought about some leaves on the tiles outside. Let me see, what else ideas I have how to mess it up  ;)

Unfortunately I'm only some little steps further. I had a horrible TG3 night...
The towel was a bad boy! a part in it had Chinese letters in it's name. TG3 rendered and also saved without any error message. But after a windowsupdate incl. restart, non of the tgd-files could be opened and I got the well known parser-error!

All files (though incrementally saved) since inserting that towel were broken.
But I could remember most settings and changes so I came back to the current level quite fast.

Even the towel could be saved. I didn't find out how to rename the part in TG3 and in Wings3D but in Blender I found that option and now its functionally  :)

Some changes are not too obvious: The basketball and the towel have a slight displacement.
In the windows there are more houseplants and I inserted the "original Terragen giveaway": the Mixed_balcony_flower_box (I preferred a box with a look like wood instead of metal) and I didn't like the dirty leather on the sofa any more - so it has a velvet-like covering now.

Inside:
[attach=1]

Outside:
[attach=2]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 11, 2015, 07:41:41 AM
good changes, might I suggest a water ring stain on the coffee table, They're drinkin JD so likely to be hammered alla time, hee hee hee
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 15, 2015, 05:29:54 AM
 :) If I need not follow your suggestion with the water ring stain I might let me persuade to put a smoking pipe on the magazine  ;)

At the moment only small steps and much detail work:

an appearance like rough plaster or woodchip

[attach=1]

I will leave out the rough plaster look in the animation, because in my tests I needed extreme detail and AA setings for my animation to avoid flicker. But for the planed still image (will be a XXXXL birthday card 60x40 cm) I use it.

Further I found mistakes in the books an I did'nt like the lamp any more - now better ones:

Old:
[attach=3]

New (only screen shot while rendering):
[attachimg=2]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 15, 2015, 05:40:21 AM
Stunning interior. But you might consider subdividing the dog one more time. And the window wood UV's are a bit strange (some stripes and angular texture there), but that's nitpicking.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 15, 2015, 06:55:55 AM
Stunning interior. But you might consider subdividing the dog one more time. And the window wood UV's are a bit strange (some stripes and angular texture there), but that's nitpicking.


Thanks Dune, but what do you mean with subdividing the dog?
The bigger pic is only a cut out part of the whole (in 5000x2000) because I stopped the renderjob to change the lamp and the books (and some more things)

The window frame thing: I have seen it this morning too and I was sure you would see it too  ;D
In fact not good texture mapping in the original model, but that's far, far, far beyond my abilities.

Let's say the house is built reasonably priced and with the support of some illegal workers  8)


Update 9.50 am:
I studied some things. I found subdividing in only two TG3 functions:
Raytracing objects in a separate deferred render pass (I think I can only switch on "raytrace objects" - I did)
Second was in prelocate subdiv cache (I understood this way that it's som kind of setting the minimum reserved memory for rendering)

Where did I miss something?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 15, 2015, 09:16:01 AM
I mean the dog object (in Poseray or so); you can see it's blocky hindquarters.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 15, 2015, 09:34:09 AM
Ahhh, I understand ... in Wings3D I'd use the function "smooth" to get more polygons...

.. trying...
Funny thing... I didn't believe, it would work and keep the texture mapping, but seems it does:

Only 3D preview:

[attach=1]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 15, 2015, 10:51:38 AM
in fact it works - here a fast test render:

[attach=1]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 15, 2015, 02:07:28 PM
Yeah, much better indeed.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Hannes on May 15, 2015, 03:31:31 PM
We seem to like dogs ;-)
Great work. Looking forward to your next iteration.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 15, 2015, 03:37:35 PM
dogs are good...god with 2 o's

and big improvement in the pooch...like the new lamp and wall tex...too bad bout the windows. Have you tried remappimg them with Cubic U/V in PoseRay in Material>UV?...I have saved a few screwy maps that way.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: j meyer on May 15, 2015, 04:29:34 PM
Nice improvements.
Indeed the smooth in Wings is what is called subdivision elsewhere.
I would not recommend cubic mapping for the wooden frame parts.Better is to look
up the existing mapping and fix it appropriately.If the parts allow it could be done
in Poseray with planar mapping,but you should be able to fix it in Wings.
Let me know,if you need some help with that.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 16, 2015, 09:09:12 AM
Thanks  j meyer & bobbystahr. i already played almost one night with the house in wings3d.

If I hadn't the pressure to finish at least the birthday card on Wednesday I would have done more research. But for the moment I darkened the diffuse color light a little bit until you almost don't see the mistake any more:

[attachimg=1]

Maybe in the future animation it's even less significant (720p with 3-4 detail and AA) but it will be an interesting learning process. I almost caught the culprit in wings3d. But I had to recognize, that all windows and doors together are one single part in TG3 but many more separated parts in wings. First remapping generally worked and the window arches looked better but I messed up all the other wooden parts... I'll keep this as learning lesson for another time.

I also had my first look at poseray... Äähm sorry... At wings I'm on user level 0.005 now (can do things without destroying my PC  ;) ) But poseray is absolute strange for me at this moment  :o
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Hannes on May 16, 2015, 12:09:51 PM
Since we have quite similar plants in our interior images, here's a tipp:
Try to get some better flower pots, place them exactly where the ugly Xfrog pots are and set the opacity of the Xfrog-pot-shaders to 0. When I created the first version I wasn't aware how ugly these pots are. And there's only this particular one in the houseplant's collection  :(.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 16, 2015, 11:22:00 PM
Thanks  j meyer & bobbystahr. i already played almost one night with the house in wings3d.

Hiya        ,
        Well I thought I recognized the model as one I'd started working with but got unsatisfactory results with the old ver. of the Water shader. Your render triggered me to revisit the project and I came up with this water.
       j meyer and I have done considerable testing with variable transparency for stained glass windows mainly but it also applies to water.The renders attached are using  the settings in the attached clip files but everything is adjustable in the Merge shaders mainly. I've included the default and parts shaders so you can see where to connect the Water and Merge shaders
Here's another thought(now acted upon)those marble spheres on the fence can be turned into yard lights and here's a .tgc for that as well if you're into it; usage instructions in it's Note. I added a point light to each one all set to:
0.25
1
1
1
with soft shadows  and set the Sun low in the sky; Power 1 .
I find it best to right click and add clip file from next to the parts stack in the internal network and connecting manually rather than inserting, especially with these as they have a redundant default part shader in them, no instructions and you're only using the act-ors as it were.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 17, 2015, 06:00:41 AM
Hey cool, bobbystahr

I'll check what I can learn and use from the tgc's.

Nice idea with the marble spheres!
I'm curious, if my "special" plan will work: I want a night scene with under water lighting in the pool... But a long way and some other priorities until there...

Still waiting for the 5000x2813 birthday-card render... tomorrow I must send it to the online print shop.


On my fast i7 PC the first 50 frames of animating the clock are done...
Since I saw interesting pricing on pixel plow, my resistance decreases continuously. But I must read more about technical details. This scene contains app. 140 Objects and I'm not sure about many details... and I must clean up my node network. If pixel plow sees the mess in my node network, they will increase the price 5 times for me  ;D  ... In the last two weeks with just adding and setting up all the objects I preferred to work in the left side object overview... The network looks horrible.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 17, 2015, 06:59:16 AM
Pixelplow won't see any mess, it's all automated and flushed after rendering. If it works for you, it works there. I only had some trouble when I wanted a really HUGE exr still, on which their stitching computers crashed, but I think they have that also solved now.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 18, 2015, 04:54:49 PM
The Birthday card in in the print shop, but there are some details in the TV, I cannot show, because of Copyright...
60x40 cm - biggest Birthday card ever  ;)

I will render a neutral Version for showing here...
So only some detail work today...
A Bottle:
[attach=1]

Another Bottle:
[attach=2]

Both will only be seen behind the glass of the rack, but I used the time for some experiments with objects, part shaders...
Behind the glass doors:
[attach=3]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 19, 2015, 07:21:14 AM
Leaves in the window seem to be cut off. The bottles are terrific!
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 19, 2015, 08:58:47 PM
Yeah, odd that. Maybe a bad alpha channel or just a sad modeling job? The bottles rock for sure, too bad they'll be hidden.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 22, 2015, 12:30:54 PM
...a further intermediate step
I could speedup the rendertime from 45 to 25 hours... (my repair-job created some new nodes like all light sources a double instance, a second planet, background... really a mess, but node network should be OK now)

Some new details:
surface of the rack under TV repaired.
Added some books there.
A pillow and a wool blanket on the sofa.
Recolored the bottles in the rack and reduced reflectivity of the glassdoors to have a better view on them
A tablet for jack Daniels and glass
Candles on table
and some wings3d-work on the Dreamcatcher so that the feathers don't disappear into the wall...

[attach=1]


... parallel I created a moonlight view with under water lights:

[attach=2]

More things running... I would need ten more hands...  ;D
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 22, 2015, 01:17:27 PM
Nice night view of the pool. All improvements are just that..well done.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: inkydigit on May 22, 2015, 01:26:34 PM
I love this series, great progression, and inspirational too!
Cheers
Jason
 :)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 23, 2015, 06:18:26 AM
Another great update.  I like the DOF as well, but it will take render time. Very nice light on the pool as well, very realistic.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 23, 2015, 09:28:33 AM
Thank you very much, guys. First week of my summer holidays is over now and I'm happy of some little progress  :)

In fact the DOF is a special problem. In some experiments I had to delete the window glasses. I tried hundreds of settings and could not get a sharp background with blurred window frame with the camera close to the window with the banana plant.  I just programmed an animation with changing nothing but the focus distance and aperture. I only got completely blurred pictures or completely sharp pictures. I don't understand why the DoF works from the distance.

When I took away the windows glass I had success immediately. All variations of DoF worked perfectly! Anyway for my plan it also works without the glass because I can dispense with the reflection.

Additionally you perhaps can see that the night scene is without DoF. I left it away to optimize rendertime, because the two additional under water lights increase the rendertime anyway  ;).

The night scene is already rendering in an animation. (frame 82 of 375 within 33 hours is a good progress)
So far it looks good... I saw even the moving reflections of the animated water on the lit walls and columns...


Before I forget: dune, you're right with the banana... in fact the two leaves in the window are not really modeled very good. I will change the plant with a dracena palm.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: j meyer on May 23, 2015, 03:49:06 PM
The Dof thing is interesting.Reminds me of the fact that the AO effect is
not rendered behind transparent (glass or water shader) objects.
Seems to be a similar effect,if not the same.

If the banana texture is complete you could just modify the geometry of
the leaves maybe.
Keep it up Nils.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: TheBadger on May 24, 2015, 07:21:10 AM
Some of this turned out really well. Lots of work I think. Always impressed when people make things work good that maybe shouldn't.
 8)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 24, 2015, 04:02:21 PM
The Dof thing is interesting.Reminds me of the fact that the AO effect is
not rendered behind transparent (glass or water shader) objects.
Seems to be a similar effect,if not the same.

If the banana texture is complete you could just modify the geometry of
the leaves maybe.
Keep it up Nils.

Hadn't noticed the AO behind transparency non effect and DoF has always been held in reserve due to rendertimes on my box so good info to know.

RE: the pic Doc, a dream catcher should be hung in a window as it does no metaphysical good against a wall according to my First Nations pals...have one in my bedroom window and dream sweetly every night. Didn't really notice it before all these fine improvements. Love the titles on the books on the shelf, that made a big if subtle difference.

Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 25, 2015, 08:52:51 AM
Thanks bobbystar, I will see how I can give a better place to the dream catcher.

Today let's take a first glance at the landscape... The house and the pool must be somewhere, right?  :)

[attach=1]

First I just wanted to do a test, where the house could be... but I couldn't stop.
So I used the time to create something I always dreamed about: a big big rapeseed field... 

I don't know If it makes sense to animate the scene because I've made the experience that you never get rid of flickering of small objects like in grass populations... Let's wait and see.


Update 11:17 am:
I did a test: even with no camera changes (no movement) and with 16 frames blending GI I get flickering of grass...
Regardless of the AA settings (with high AA I only get a blurred flickering + exploded render time)
Is it something with the population? It seames the smaller the object or object part, the bigger the flickering.
With fast camera movements that is not as apparent but with a still or slow moving camera it's a problem.
Where is the trick - where is the mistake - where could this come from?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Cocateho on May 25, 2015, 03:10:49 PM
Thanks bobbystar, I will see how I can give a better place to the dream catcher.

Today let's take a first glance at the landscape... The house and the pool must be somewhere, right?  :)

(Attachment Link)

First I just wanted to do a test, where the house could be... but I couldn't stop.
So I used the time to create something I always dreamed about: a big big rapeseed field... 

I don't know If it makes sense to animate the scene because I've made the experience that you never get rid of flickering of small objects like in grass populations... Let's wait and see.


Update 11:17 am:
I did a test: even with no camera changes (no movement) and with 16 frames blending GI I get flickering of grass...
Regardless of the AA settings (with high AA I only get a blurred flickering + exploded render time)
Is it something with the population? It seames the smaller the object or object part, the bigger the flickering.
With fast camera movements that is not as apparent but with a still or slow moving camera it's a problem.
Where is the trick - where is the mistake - where could this come from?

Funny, I have a big rapeseed field behind the house myself! Not mine, but I can go look whenever I want.[attach=1]

Also, when is this house going up for sale?  :P

As far as the image It seems very soft, is this the AA filter or is there a little DoF going on in the background?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on May 25, 2015, 03:30:58 PM
Those must be millions of instances  :o

Verticals are hard, also in animation. Dorian and I had trouble with the vertical stems of reeds when doing animation. Perhaps if you shift the angle of the main object a bit, so they all are at a slight angle, that may help. It may.... not sure at all.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 25, 2015, 04:06:40 PM
Here in the colonies we call it [rapeseed] Canola because it's all GMO...sigh. That's why we can't sell it in the Euro Zone.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 26, 2015, 10:29:18 AM
I saw a similar field in 2012 too and was so impressed!
This is only a still from a video I made with my mobile:
[attach=1]

Dune, I think it must be about 2-3 million rapeseed plants (xFrog) and about 5-10 million grass-patches (Walli_plant_pack1)

I did some Experiments with your suggestion with angles up to 15 degree. The flickering just changes it's view but I don't get rid of it. Having more than 25 frames I could see it's so fast, that it's only disturbing if you focus it. But here in the forum we are naturally focused on  ;)

Beside I learned that I very often must care about the xFrog plants settings. Many of them need some work because the opacity image has to be added manually... I wondered why the colors were so dark and weird - missing opacity images were the solution.

Cocateho, no chance for a sale - that is to become my retirement home one day... if I ever win in a lottery - I guess I should start to play in one - right?  ;D
But I'll tell you if they build another house somewhere there :)
And the softness - There's just minimal blur, AA Filter and maybe also a lightly increased haze could be the cause.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Hannes on May 26, 2015, 01:29:21 PM
I like your last image a lot. It looks very calm and beautiful.
Anyway I think that you should try a higher occlusion weight (GISD). The bike seems to float. How are your settings?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 26, 2015, 02:09:10 PM
Hannes, maybe you bring me on the way to eliminate a mistake I saw in all the house-renders: where I don't have direct sunlight, I also don't get shadows...

Untill now I never played with occlusion weight. Actually set on 1,1,24 (occlusion, bounce, radius) + falloff activated
So far I didn't learn anything about the GI surface details settings - so I didn't touch them  ;)
I only use GI settings to avoid flickering in animations (blend mode "interpolate") and keep illumination on similar levels when I do different experiments with the same image (blend mode "one file")

At the moment some (animation) render jobs are running, but I will test when a PC is free again.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 28, 2015, 06:56:20 PM
I would have to take a closer look to the settings... occlusion weight wasn't set to active - the checkmark was missing!   :P
I will have to re-render many images!

But I already see improvements - less elements floating now  ;)
Additionally I added some new residents on the grass.
Recolored the Viper so it looks less intrusive now.
Some cucumber branches (I didn't like any of the ivy I found - so I improvised)

Little improvements - step by step...

[attach=1]


Here the same scene from inside the house (unfortunately with deleted glass - because of the problem with the DoF)

[attach=2]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Hannes on May 29, 2015, 04:37:15 AM
Better now. But to my taste there's still not enough occlusion weight. Sorry, silly question: is GISD checked? If so, you could try an occlusion weight of 1.5 or even 2.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 29, 2015, 05:20:52 AM
GISD not checked  was the reason for all the floating objects in all my images (also other projects).

I tried higher occlusion weight but got too dark frames on all object edges (especially the room corners got too black). I tried many settings and 0.8 occlusion weight and 25 radius was the best compromise.

What does bounce to the ounce do? perhaps I can play with this setting too?

At the moment I test a big render of the inside view of the room with GSID "on". Unfortunately the function seems to be added after finished rendering earliest. The smaller render already shows first success. The rack with the bottles on the right side didn't throw a shadow onto the wall before, what disturbed me most.

[attach=1]

Only 720p / AA3 / details0.3 upscaled. That was the first test with the new settings. I almost completely needed new light setting including gamma, sunstrength, camera exposureand others... but the light outside the windows now looks better.  Also I moved the sun a bit to get a slight shine onto dog's nose. At first sight seems quite dark, but after looking into all my rooms I found it's much more realistic. (I think HDR effects are intersting but I don't really like)

(Besides thanks for the suggestion with the pots, I did not ignore but somehow I like these plant pots with the basket look  :)  )

Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 29, 2015, 06:12:17 AM
Perfect placement of the Dream Catcher...When I had a render get this dark I went into the lighting tab and upped my Global Illumination on Surfaces to I think 2, but maybe 1.5. It wasn't much but it brought up some over dark areas. Bounce to the ounce seems to work mainly with GI but is greyed out for AO so that may help as well.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 29, 2015, 07:21:58 AM
Great  :)
Means, that I now understand more about placing a dream catcher than to do Terragen settings  ;)

The darkness in the room is as I intended (maybe on other PC monitors it looks darker than on mine - here it's OK).
So eg. I didn't want to brighten the dog but change the sun direction to get natural light on his nose.

All in all, I hope you get the similar impression like me: A slightly dim lit room in the morning. In a room like this you will not see too much details until your eyes have adjusted...
But let's wait how the bigger rendered image will look like.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on May 29, 2015, 07:23:37 AM
Got you...knowing time of day puts a different 'light' on it, heh heh heh
Looks like 9:10 A M by the clock.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 29, 2015, 07:31:42 AM
Exactly right!  :D

Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: archonforest on May 29, 2015, 01:21:37 PM
I like this last one a lot.  ...but where is the girl go...?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Hannes on May 29, 2015, 01:31:33 PM
Much better now!!!
These are the settings of my Hammond B3 interior image. Maybe they are useful for you?

Sunlight strength: 4.5
Enviro light/Strength on surfaces: 3
GI cache detail: 4
GI sample quality: 4
GISD occlusion weight: 2
Render/Effects: Contrast: 0.25, Gamma corr.: 1.9

The rest is default.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 29, 2015, 01:51:20 PM
Thanks :)


Funny... I have similar settings
Enviro light/Strength on surfaces: 3.5
Sun is 3.6
Render/Effects: Contrast: 0.25, Gamma corr.: 1.5 (lower gamma for the intended harder dark areas)

GI detail and quality only on 2 - I tried higher settings but saw no improvements - only bigger GI cache-file

The occlusion weight higher than 0.6-0.8 began to result in hard black lines and increasing the radius only blurred them...

Something I recognized: every times I rendered a GI cache file, I got different results. Sometimes even bad results with hard color boundaries eg. in the wall. I tried up to 20-30 GI cache files until I found one that was good. How can this happen?

I think if this is a general problem, there must be a big problem in animations too !?
In some of my animation tests I saw changing shadow-darkness in the middle of the animation without any recognizable reason.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Kadri on May 29, 2015, 02:05:34 PM

Maybe this is a little help:
http://www.planetside.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,18209.msg176525.html#msg176525

Maybe there is more i don't know.
http://www.planetside.co.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Terragen_2_Global_Illumination#Render_GI_Settings
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 29, 2015, 02:31:29 PM
Cool Kadri  ;)  The first link is one of the most helpful I already found two days ago  :)

The second link unfortunately has to many "TBC"
But yours was extremely helpful, Thanks!
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Kadri on May 29, 2015, 03:14:49 PM
:)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: j meyer on May 29, 2015, 05:29:52 PM
Quote
...(I didn't like any of the ivy I found - so I improvised)...

Already tested this one: http://vivec3d.com/3d-ivy-generator-2012/  ?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 29, 2015, 06:03:16 PM
Hey Jochen, that looks very, very intersting! Thanks! I'll test as soon as I get a free PC (all of them busy and pixelplow still no registration with paypal instead of credit card possible)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on May 31, 2015, 03:59:37 PM
That's it for the moment, my holidays are over now but the last lesson was quite interesting.
The ivy-generator worked quite good after I tried several settings.
Some occlusion weight settings are new too.. They seem to be really extremely dependend on the resolution of the image.

[attach=1]


The inside image is updated with higher occlusion weight settings too.

2D:

[attach=2]

3D anaglyphic (red blue glasses needed):

[attach=3]


Time to reduce some details again for animation.
Unfortunately the dog and the horses must go...
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Kadri on May 31, 2015, 04:39:18 PM

Looks good.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on June 01, 2015, 05:47:25 AM
Indeed. I do wonder about the lighness of the shadows on the outside render. Isn't enviro light a tad too high? Inside is just perfect!!
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on June 01, 2015, 06:30:14 AM
Sorry, Dune, my fault: I increased gamma in postwork for the mobiles of my girl and my stepdaughter (she had the ivy-wish).
at home it looked ok as well but here in office I see that unnatuaral brightness too.

The 3D anaglyphic image is intended to be quite bright. The blue-red glasses are mostly so dark, that you cannot see anything.

Anyway I must reorganize complete lighting, details and some other things for my animations in 720p. I found out that eg. detail setting, displacement (PFs) and occlusion weight react very different in different render resolutions.

Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on September 01, 2016, 09:57:57 PM
Two of the last TG4 remining days: 0 - renders and a big step back to another WIP.

Step by step, day by day, month by month I get the puzzle together.

The big showdown! I hope the light and the clock give the hint when it will be  ;)

only small test of the light and cam position (frame 1400  ;)  )
[attach=1]

I had to stop this render but could save a part before TG froze again.
Frame 0001.

[attach=2]

I am planning to do a slow motion capture of the second hand of the clock when it is switching from second 59 to 60...
In closeup with overdone DoF of course  ;D
I hope I get my new memory for the instable PC on monday to go on... 
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on September 02, 2016, 06:33:27 AM
I guess you'll have to upgrade to TG4. I wonder if the TG evaluation version will just stop working in mid render or only doesn't work again after startup.

Anyway, a question; what is that wording about 'copied... China' in your second image?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on September 02, 2016, 06:50:54 AM
So far the rendering TG4 versions did not stop the renderjobs. And some hours ago I got the prepurchasers email ... only to wait until sunday for the release licence ... HAPPY DAY!!!  :)

The "copied ... China" is a (politically not absolutely correct) joke in relation to all the fake products and iPhone copies coming from there... in an older post you can see it better but there the light isn't as I want / need now in the film:

http://www.planetside.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,19941.msg196604.html#msg196604 (http://www.planetside.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,19941.msg196604.html#msg196604)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on September 02, 2016, 06:54:24 AM
Ah. Thanks Nils.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on September 02, 2016, 06:58:52 AM
Any time, Ulco  :)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on September 02, 2016, 07:00:39 AM
Ah. Thanks Nils.


and thank you for asking the question that was in all our minds...heh heh
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on November 24, 2016, 07:16:43 AM
More preparation for the animation inside the poolhouse...

I had many things to change. E.g. the floor is new, an additional rack on the left side ...

Testframes 001, 199, 298

[attach=1]   [attach=2]   [attach=3]

I am not sure yet what will run on the TV in the animation. I cannot use any TV news program because of copyright... perhaps I use the "big bugs bunny" animation with the permission of the animators.  ;)


And for the first time a visible connection between the scene outside (the bike and the viper) and inside (the clock, the TV...)
In this case the overexposure of the scene outside is intended as I descibed in an earlier post.

Frames 001 and 022:

[attach=4]   [attach=5]
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on November 24, 2016, 10:01:21 AM
Quote
I am not sure yet what will run on the TV
Perhaps your own animation, a future scene?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Kadri on November 24, 2016, 10:15:50 AM

Have you a idea how long the short will be Nils? Approximately?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on November 24, 2016, 11:55:17 AM
@ Kadri:
Difficult to say.
The whole scene while the Viper is starting will have different cuts.
The upper scene with the visible TV has 500 frames - means 20 seconds.
But of course the sound of the video must also be audible when the TV is not in Focus. I think about 1-2 minutes could be enough.

@ both
Ulco, I thought about some ideas and one is in fact an own animation: I would create a kind of TV-News like in the upper Pictures. I am not sure if I do it just like that (it's just a PowerPoint sheet :) ) Or if I find a nice lady as a real reporter to talk about all the strange things happening at that time.

Two other alternatives:

a.)
Because the whole film Project shall be a kind of hommage to some films that had influence on me, I'd would like to show the "Big Buck Bunny" film on the TV because I like it very much and it I was done by just motivated hobby  artists.
Just look here: https://peach.blender.org/download/ (https://peach.blender.org/download/)

b.)
I also thought about getting the permission of some TG artists like you, Kadri - or Hannes, to show some seconds of your work. Of Course with adaequat credits in the end title.

As well there is place for two of the best renders of TG forum artists in the two Picture Frames on left side of the TV.


Not easy to decide. What is your opinion (all of you in the Forum), what would be the nicest and most sense making idea?

Unfortunately I can start the render at the earliest when I did a decision because I absolutely do not want to add the film in postwork. I will devide it into frames and render it within TG.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on November 24, 2016, 12:22:39 PM
If you play a future scene of your own movie, it won't be very noticed as a joke, maybe, as the veiwer doesn't know it's a future scene (I just realized that). You could also 'replay' some past scene, that will ring a bell. Perhaps reverse the sequence to give it a very odd time warp.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on November 24, 2016, 12:49:46 PM
The decision has been made  8) ;)

I just asked - Now I've got a nice newsreader. I will create a news about all the strange things happening in the film. This will be not your time warp, Ulco, but it will create the odd situation, where the NASA doesn't understand, where all the spaceships, a space station in the earth orbit and all the ducks come from  ;)

It's a long time since I needed my little photo studio and the cameras but I am looking forward to it... will be such a fun!  :) :D
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on November 24, 2016, 02:08:55 PM
Will you act as a Hitchcockian newsreader, appearing in your own film, or do you have some other really nice newsreader in your house?
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on November 24, 2016, 02:33:45 PM
Will you act as a Hitchcockian newsreader, appearing in your own film, or do you have some other really nice newsreader in your house?

You bring me to another idea!

UNFORTUNATELY  you - yes personally you, Ulco, are fault that I WILL be in the news  ;D ;D ;D

But only for seconds. I found two very pretty young women, who will do the newsreader job. And the TV will zapp through different countries with the same disturbing news  ;)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: bobbystahr on November 24, 2016, 02:56:24 PM
This is gonna be an awesome and very much fun animation to watch...hope I live long enough to see it, heh heh heh. Love the newsreades idea and a Nils cameo...apropos for sure.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on November 24, 2016, 03:06:55 PM
This is gonna be an awesome and very much fun animation to watch...hope I live long enough to see it, heh heh heh. Love the newsreades idea and a Nils cameo...apropos for sure.

hope I live long enough to finish the movie, heh heh heh...  ;D
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Kadri on November 24, 2016, 03:21:43 PM
...
b.)
I also thought about getting the permission of some TG artists like you, Kadri - or Hannes, to show some seconds of your work. Of Course with adaequat credits in the end title.
...

No problem for me Nils but yes Ulco's idea is good :)
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Dune on November 24, 2016, 03:36:20 PM
I hope I live long enough to have stopped laughing after seeing it  :P
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: archonforest on November 24, 2016, 03:51:40 PM
Maybe some of us can pith in with some rendering time so you finish it faster?
I personally got 2 cold Xeon in my room doin nothin hehe...(it is good for the electricity bill since the box got a 950w psu)  :D
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: Hannes on November 24, 2016, 04:21:52 PM
I also thought about getting the permission of some TG artists like you, Kadri - or Hannes, to show some seconds of your work. Of Course with adaequat credits in the end title.

Whatever you want to do, do it. You have my permission.
Title: Re: My weekend home
Post by: DocCharly65 on November 28, 2016, 07:50:55 AM
Maybe some of us can pith in with some rendering time so you finish it faster?
I personally got 2 cold Xeon in my room doin nothin hehe...(it is good for the electricity bill since the box got a 950w psu)  :D

That's a very nice offer! Thanks a lot.  :)
But at the moment I have reached another limit: The limit in my brain, how many scenes I can develop and control at the same time.

On the other side my problem at the moment is not the time and CPU power - it's that when I'm watching a render process I too often find new mistakes or have ideas for improvements or changes.

But thanks again :) !
Also thanks to Hannes & Kadri - I think there will be zapped into some seconds of your work too.
Additionally I have the option now for 3 nice female "Newsreaders" (an original Taiwanese one - I hope it's true that she want's to take part - I would love it, because I don't know any action hero or disaster movie without an asian newsreader).


Since I changed to TG4 I have possibilities, I only dreamed about before:

This render I gave up after 100 frames in TG3 last year because of extreme rendertimes of up to 2.5 h per frame.
Now I could reduce it to less than 45 min (on my slowest i7) though many reflective parts. And I could improve the look a bit :)

Frame 262 (already  ;) )
[attach=1]