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Support => Terragen Support => Topic started by: buzzzzz1 on April 04, 2009, 10:27:36 am

Title: Question about the Final?
Post by: buzzzzz1 on April 04, 2009, 10:27:36 am
Just wondering if the final release is suppose to be correctly detecting my cpu cores? If so at startup it only says I have one core and I'm running Core 2 Duo. Also with the beta when rendering with 2 cores min set TG was using 9 Threads but in the Final it's only running 7 Threads using the same settings?  Could this have something to do with my loss of render speed when I upgraded to the final version? I am and was using the Override Automatic Number of Cores Detection in both versions. I really like the new features and all in the final but don't like going backwards in terms of render speed. Most everyone has seen an increase in render speed with the final, so what am I doing wrong?  You can see my system specs in my signature below.

Thanks
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: Oshyan on April 04, 2009, 03:05:44 pm
I don't think the CPU detection has really changed since the beta, though I'm not positive on that. It sounds like the beta also didn't detect your cores properly, which is why you had the override on. This may be due to XP x64, as I'm fairly sure Core 2 Duo's are generally detected properly in other cases.

With 2 cores you should only be rendering with 2 threads, definitely not 7 or 9, so I'm confused about those numbers. I would use the override, set min threads to 2 and max threads to 2 and re-test. Improvements in detection of the number of cores may come in the future, but we've found it a pretty hit-or-miss thing, especially between OS's. It's also a challenge because some CPUs like Core i7's actually have non-physical cores that can still be treated as legitimate threads.

- Oshyan
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: Tangled-Universe on April 06, 2009, 10:37:57 am
The beta stated "4 cores deteced (user override)" or something like that if I remember correctly.
However the latest release detects 1 core, even though the override function for 4 cores is still enabled.
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: Oshyan on April 06, 2009, 11:03:39 pm
That doesn't sound right. What's your CPU and OS? Anything else changed since you were running the beta?

- Oshyan
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: jo on April 06, 2009, 11:14:54 pm
Hi,

There does seem to be a problem with what is reported on the Splash Screen. The About Box is giving the correct reading. Sorry for the confusion, this is my fault.

Regards,

Jo
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: Oshyan on April 06, 2009, 11:38:13 pm
Ah! The possibility that the actual number reported was not the number *detected* didn't occur to me. ;)

- Oshyan
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: jo on April 06, 2009, 11:45:38 pm
Hi,

Quote from: Oshyan on April 06, 2009, 11:38:13 pm
Ah! The possibility that the actual number reported was not the number *detected* didn't occur to me. ;)


The correct override settings will still be used during rendering, it's just that the override number wasn't being read from the prefs early enough to show the correct value on the splash. Embarassing mistake on my part, my testing wasn't good enough.

Regards,

Jo
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: Oshyan on April 06, 2009, 11:48:55 pm
Ok, so Buzzzz am I right in thinking then that the override was in place in the beta because it was not detecting the right number of cores automatically at that time?

- Oshyan
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: buzzzzz1 on April 07, 2009, 10:46:34 am
Quote from: Oshyan on April 06, 2009, 11:48:55 pm
Ok, so Buzzzz am I right in thinking then that the override was in place in the beta because it was not detecting the right number of cores automatically at that time?   

- Oshyan


Yes that's correct Oshyan.

Really, I guess my main question was why I lost some render speed, when everyone else seems to have gotten lessor render times with the final release. The Splash screen on start up attached. As you can see the override is enabled.  Also the Threads I was referring to are  shown in the screen capture of Task Manager. The Beta was running 9 Threads in the task manager were as the Final is showing 7.  I am assuming the more threads the better, but you know what ASSUME stands for.  ;)

That's OK I'll live with it.

Thanks for replying,


Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: nanogear on April 08, 2009, 12:49:27 am
Buzzzzz1, I don't think all those threads are used for rendering.  I have a two core AMD, and when I open TG2 I see three threads running when the app is idle, but after a few minutes it drops to two threads.  When I start a render the thread count jumps up by two, in my case.  The thread count seems to fluctuate, as I once saw the thread count jump to 7, but haven't seen that happen again.

Jeff
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: jo on April 08, 2009, 01:38:12 am
Hi,

One of the threads is the main application thread. One thread around startup time is used by the update checker if automatic checking is turned on, although that will only run for a short time. Some of the other threads are probably ones created by the OS for various things. On my PC there are 3 threads running when the application is idle. I don't have tools to give me information about what the threads are doing on Windows, but on the Mac when the app is running "normally" there is one application thread and two which have been created by the OS. When you render the number of threads will increase by however many threads are being used for rendering.

Have you tried the new benchmark scene ( not sure where you get that from, Oshyan knows :-) to check the difference between the beta and the final? You could need to take into consideration whether other people are seeing a slowdown as well. It may be that if some scenes of yours are rendering slower in the final then they might have something which was made more accurate/improved but slower between the beta and the final, for example.

Regards,

Jo
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: buzzzzz1 on April 08, 2009, 10:20:39 am
Thanks for replying nanogear and Jo.   

With the Beta Version my render time for this benchmark scene http://www.3dspeedmachine.com/images/getImage.php?size=1&id=40 (http://www.3dspeedmachine.com/images/getImage.php?size=1&id=40) created by Oshyan was 21min. 6 sec. and with the Final Version rendering the same scene my render time was 21 min. 51 sec.

Only an increase of 3 or 4%, so Like I said , I can live with it.    Thanks again for your help.
Title: Re: Question about the Final?
Post by: Oshyan on April 09, 2009, 01:26:36 am
5% is probably within margin of error for the test quite honestly. Is this repeatable?

- Oshyan