procedural population variation

[Volker Harun]

This is a nice render The Pops look very good.

For the Perlin ... here is an idea that might help ... http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=10826.msg111379#msg111379

For the colouring ... I think two Mix colour would be perfect to make the scene ultra realistic. One large scale and one small scale. Use the Transformshader to scale the one or both inputs of the Mix colour.

Cheers,
Volker

[Dune]

already found it!

Ah! So this would perhaps be perfect to use as 'global variation node set' for pops. Looks nice and PF like, especially if its appearance can be 'seeded'. Thanks Volker. I'll check it out.

[dandelO]

Ulco: I'd put the shaders inside the object because it's the object I'd want to apply colour variations to, over the population space.
I don't need to plug this into a surface layer, I use the shader preview in new window every time I'm working on a shader set. I open the uppermost shader preview in a window of its own and anything downwards from this shader that is edited is translated to that final shader preview. It's also easily zoomed in and out to lots of different distances/scales so my camera never actually needs to move to check this.

I suppose everyone has their own methods and practises when designing things.

[Dune]

@ Martin: Ah, but 'shader preview in a new window' is something totally unfamiliar with me. Never do that. You're right; everybody his/her own ways.

@ Volker; I tried your 'stone' nodes, replaced the get position in texture/geometry by a get position (or it wouldn't work), but the PF that you included is still only working on object level (in my WIN version at least), although blended by the global perlin. So I'll stick to a combination of perlin and voronoi. The smooth step is excellent, although I changed the -1 to -0.5 to get a little more spunk.

One thing I don't understand yet is how to achieve another distribution of the perlin 3D. When I stick a PF into its .. (arse, I wanted to say) seed, and hit random, nothing changes. Even applying a redirect or transform shader anywhere in the line of nodes doesn't change the pattern.    Does anyone have the solution for a nice button to simply change the pattern?

---Dune

Ah! I hit the 1000 posts level 

[j meyer]

Dune - You're right i used a PF.I did several tests with PFs earlier in regard
           to coloring non-uved objects and found that a surface layer between
           the parts shader and the surface input of the object still accepts a
           PF as blending shader.And i wanted to test if it works on the next
           level (between the default shader and the gray one),too.And i was
           refering to an effect i noticed.
           Just tried to find out what works and what not.Since RTO was introduced
           there seems to be something wrong with PFs and objects and i think the
           more we find out,the easier it's for Panetside to solve these problems,
           hopefully.
           Sorry for any confusion.

[dandelO]

I changed the -1 to -0.5 to get a little more spunk.

I'll have to try that one on my birthday! (I'm not sure that'll translate very well to anyone but us nasty Brits!)

And it gets better yet!

When I stick a PF into its ..

Brilliant post, Ulco!

[Volker Harun]

Well, a perlin's seed is not used to broken stuff ... you ought to try something more smooth. Integer numbers are just fine to use

The smooth step wasn't my fault there, by the way ...

[jo]

Hi Dune,

Back to basics. Volker's perlin 3D setup is a nice way to get a bit smoother variation and not the harsh gradients when you use just one perlin 3D. That's why I've stacked a couple and played with the mergers, and an adjust color. But it's hard to get a nice 'real' fractal variation, and for such we would indeed need a 'fixer' such as the simple shape shader, where basic coordinates can be given to a node which accepts a stack of PF's, which at that point are set at this reference. Maybe that's not to hard for Matt, Jo, or Oshyan to implement (?).

Basically you're after a multifractal version of the Perlin 3D node?

If normal PF's work globally on a Mac perhaps these gentlemen also know what is the difference between the Mac and Win version?

There shouldn't be any difference between how this works on the Mac and PC. It's all the same code. If it were working differently it would be a bizarre sort of a bug. My first inclination would be to suggest Volker is doing something differently than you think he is.

@ jmeyer: how can you set a perlin 3D to ridges? I presume you used a red PF instead, and then the global reference doesn't work anymore and you'd get the normal color for your objects.

I know this isn't quite what you're saying, but if you weren't aware you can make a ridged or billows version of the Perlin 3D noise by modifying the output. Looking at the power fractal code it seems that the "billows" mode comes from using an Abs function and the "ridged" mode looks like it's Abs followed by a Complement. The mixed modes aren't achievable with the Perlin 3D node. Anyway, I'm sure you guys had figured this out already :-). I've attached a screenshot showing normal Perlin 3D, ridged Perlin 3D and billows Perlin 3D.

Regards,

Jo

[Dune]

@ Martin:

I'll have to try that one on my birthday!

You're going to have a treat on your birthday then?    (I was referring to the first of the 'freedictionary' translation, actually). Didn't even know the second, as I'm not a Brit.

@ Jo: Thanks for your input. And yes, a multifractal (more varied) 'seedable' perlin 3D node which can be stuck to a global perspective as it now is with the get function would be fantastic. Perhaps Volker is doing something different, but I haven't figured out what...

Volker??? Or did I misinterpret your findings?

[Volker Harun]

Volker??? Or did I misinterpret your findings?

I don't know, I always used the same setup as on the first page of this thread: http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=10810.msg111137#msg111137
Sometimes with different objects, sometimes only the blue part on several parts of an object, sometimes the PF-part only, sometimes a mixture ...

dandelO's render needed a bypass, but it worked: http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=10810.msg111151#msg111151

I think, as long as the result is effective, you have the solution.

,-) Volker

[FrankB]

it may not be worth opening an image thread for this. I just refined my color variations somewhat. I still use two mixed perlins to provide the variation pattern for 2 default shaders with color functions. It's a method that I think works well.
Of course, ideally we would be able simple choose whether an in-object color function relates to object- or world-scale.

Here's another doodle. I kinda liked the outcome. Secondly, gentlemen, you are looking at 12.5 million gras clump instances
Other stats are GI 1/1, detail 0.3, AA4. I've run it through a color filter in post to light it up somewhat. Rendered 17 minutes, a lot of that was population time.

Cheers,
Frank

[Volker Harun]

You have mastered the grass clumps .... I really like the mood of this render!

[domdib]

I agree with Volker. The distance from the grass clumps is just right, so they produce an extremely convincing texture (aided by the excellent lighting). And the colour variation is beautifully subtle. If you worked a bit on the soil texture, and made sure none of the trees looked as if they were partially buried, this would be a winner.

[FrankB]

a second one for the same scene, different perspective and lower. nothing special, just for completeness... I guess.

[Walli]

very nice Frank, the color variations really add a lot!