My wish list...

[blackcat]

I've been working hard at applying TG2 to real-world practical uses. For instance, a professional artist needs to meet deadlines, which usually leave very little room for experimentation or steep learning curves. Needless to say, TG2 been pretty successful. In many cases, however, the final result has depended a great deal on my abilities to continue working on a render after TG2 is done with it. That is, I don't require TG2 to do everything for me. Nevertheless, there are some things I wish it did better.

I wish it had a more intuitive interface (something many of my illustrator colleagues have a problem with, too. Like me, they need a program that doesn't require a huge investment in time spent on climbing a learning curve). And I wish its units of measurement were used consistently (for instance, it seems as though "2.321" in one place is the same as "2321" in another).

And, for heaven's sake, I think by now this thing would have a manual.

I would like to be able to import my own maps for clouds.

It would be pretty cool if TG2 included lighting effects such as halos, rainbows, parhelia, etc...but that would really be icing on the cake (and something HaloSim does very well).

I would like to be able to draw heightfield maps directly in TG2 (at the moment I create all of mine by hand in Photoshop, then import them), or be able to do fine-tuning on pre-existing imported maps.

I would like to be able to tilt water surfaces. At the moment, the lake surface is parallel to the horizon (or, maybe more accurately, perpendicular to the planet's radius). This is fine for lakes and oceans, but rivers don't work that way. One end is higher than the other, with the water surface flowing at an angle to the horizon. Being able to tilt the surface of a lake on the x and y axes would be a very, very useful thing.

I would like to be able to control the color of water. At the moment (unless I'm very wrong), the color is determined by the color of the sky (which is only a partially realistic effect in any case). But few bodies of water are made of perfectly clear liquid, as TG2 seems to assume. It would be nice, too, if waves reacted to the landscape, so they refracted and reflected from shorelines and rocks. Wind direction as an influence on waves would be a nice feature, too.

There's more, but that's all I can recall this early in the morning.

[Kevin F]

I would like to be able to control the color of water. At the moment (unless I'm very wrong), the color is determined by the color of the sky (which is only a partially realistic effect in any case).

Well you must be very wrong!
see http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=11006.msg112790#msg112790
for an example.

[freelancah]

Hmmm..tilted water surfaces for rivers.. would this be what you're looking for? http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=8793.msg115607#msg115607

[blackcat]

Well, well! Whattaya know!

I shall certainly give those a shot.

It'd be nice, though, if the methodology for both were a little more direct (for instance, as in TG1 where the color could be changed very simply along with the other water parameters). How much quicker it would be to simply choose a color in the Water Shader pane instead of jumping through so many hoops. This is the kind of thing I was talking about where simplification and directness (as opposed to time spent in experimentation) would be valuable to an artist using TG2 in meeting a deadline.

[Seth]

errr... the water colour can be changed very easily with the other water parameters...

[neuspadrin]

For water color check out "decay tint" and "volume 1 colour" in the Water Shader sub-surface tab.  These control how the water will be colored. Sky color does affect it too, but you can also change reflectivity etc I believe to remove some of that from happening if you wish.  Pretty easily and within the water shader options :/ Must've missed it? Volume 1 colour could probably use a bit better labeling maybe.

Hmmm..tilted water surfaces for rivers.. would this be what you're looking for? http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=8793.msg115607#msg115607

Yep to this one too, its possible just requires a little workaround. I've hit a few occasional problems with it but so far they were pretty easy to work around with a few more nodes.


"I would like to be able to draw heightfield maps directly in TG2 (at the moment I create all of mine by hand in Photoshop, then import them), or be able to do fine-tuning on pre-existing imported maps."
You can somewhat do this through the painted shader and a displacement function. Its pretty primitive compared to the control you will get in photoshop though. You can also use something like GeoControl which if I recall allows for you to create terrains through a very visual /drawing kind of way of setting out lines, then setting various height controls, etc.

"It would be pretty cool if TG2 included lighting effects such as halos, rainbows, parhelia, etc...but that would really be icing on the cake."
There are hacks of ways to do many things in TG2 -- would be nice to have an easier way I agree.  Theres another thread going on talking about those.



Mainly, yes we do lack a manual, but it would also be hard to create a manual that easily explains all of this to everyone.  One nice thing is more of a "living" manual of the forums.  Always feel free to ask about something if you are stuck.  Odds are one of us has played around with that concept before and have some links of information to give you. Or sometimes help you with what you might need, point in the right direction, etc. Very supportive community.

[blackcat]

For water color check out "decay tint" and "volume 1 colour" in the Water Shader sub-surface tab.  These control how the water will be colored. Sky color does affect it too, but you can also change reflectivity etc I believe to remove some of that from happening if you wish.  Pretty easily and within the water shader options :/ Must've missed it? Volume 1 colour could probably use a bit better labeling maybe.

Probably!

I'll play with those and see what happens!

Hmmm..tilted water surfaces for rivers.. would this be what you're looking for? http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=8793.msg115607#msg115607

Yep to this one too, its possible just requires a little workaround. I've hit a few occasional problems with it but so far they were pretty easy to work around with a few more nodes.

You see, "workarounds" is what I'm trying to avoid.

As you may know, I'm a professional illustrator. I and many of my colleagues are often frustrated by what it sometimes takes to accomplish in TG2...especially things that would appear could be made very simple. I know that it's the reason many of my friends either don't want to bother with TG2 or abandon it. It's sometimes easier to accomplish what they want in other ways...especially if there is an art director breathing down their necks.

Mainly, yes we do lack a manual, but it would also be hard to create a manual that easily explains all of this to everyone.

Oh, I don't think so!  

[blackcat]

For water color check out "decay tint" and "volume 1 colour" in the Water Shader sub-surface tab.  These control how the water will be colored. Sky color does affect it too, but you can also change reflectivity etc I believe to remove some of that from happening if you wish.  Pretty easily and within the water shader options :/ Must've missed it? Volume 1 colour could probably use a bit better labeling maybe.

Seems to have no effect.

Still fiddling, though...

[Seth]

of course it has effect !!!

create a water object
go into the water shader
go into the sub-surface tab
put 1 as value for volume 1 density (you can change the colour by changing "volume 1 colour")

[neuspadrin]

As seth mentioned you need to change the density such that there is actual density of the water going on. 

Example: tint and volume 1 color set to pink, density at 1.

[blackcat]

Thanks, guys!

[Seth]

[blackcat]

The only downside I can see is that the water needs to be transparent... unless someone has an idea about that. Then again, it's possible that transparency may not affect what I want to do.

[Seth]

put a powerfractal between  the water shader and the lake object.
and even with a transparency of 0, you can see the colour changed.
play with offset to reduce the visibility of the new colour.
with different scales , you'll get different coulours in the water (like muddy water ou of bright water)
you can have 2 colours water with high contrast and correct value...

seriously, man, the water in TG2 is real good and the only weak point i can imagine for the workaround stuff, will be to make really convincing waves (like shores and all). not mentionning animating waves

[Oshyan]

I'm actually pleased to see that the majority of your suggestions are already possible, several of them without "workarounds" (yet what is a "workaround" but simply a way to do something that is not what you expect?). The biggest outstanding issue with most of your requests would seem to be the lack of a comprehensive manual which should at least tell you one way (of many possible) to accomplish much of what you want to do. We certainly agree that docs are needed, and work is being done in that area.

One thing no one seems to have addressed is that you can already easily import your own cloud maps. Simply plug an Image Map Shader into the Density Shader input of a Cloud Layer, load your image map (of the cloud shapes you want to use), and apply the correct projection. For example if you are loading a full global cloud map in a spherical projection, then use Spherical Mapping in the Image Map Shader. That will get you the basic shapes driving your clouds, but you may want more realistic edges, break-up, etc. in which case you could use the Image Map Shader instead as a Blend Shader for the normal Cloud Layer Density Shader.

- Oshyan