Vue Infinity

Started by rcallicotte, April 28, 2007, 05:55:13 pm

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rcallicotte

e-on's Vue 6 software looks really good.  Does anyone know the major differences between it and TG2?  How much latitude is there in Vue to do terrain work like we can do in TG2?  I'm not starting a riot or anything obsolete since the 60s.  Just asking questions.
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

old_blaggard

Actually, that's a very good question.  I think the general consensus right now is that it's difficult to compare the two because TG2 is still in the alpha stage whereas Vue is a mature product.  Vue definitely has some advantages over TG2, such as its Ecosystem stuff, better object support, mature UI, and stable rendering system.  However, TG2's renderer as a whole seems to me to be much more realistic, and I don't think anything else out there can produce the awesome clouds that TG2 is capable of - not Vue (even with metaclouds and spectal atmosphere) and not Mojoworld (even with Dmytry's volumetric plugin).

Most of this stuff is actually rehashing what Oshyan has said on various forums (I happen to agree with it ;)), so I'm sure he could give a much more detailed answer if you want.
http://www.terragen.org - A great Terragen resource with models, contests, galleries, and forums.

rcallicotte

Thanks old_blaggard.  I'm not in any hurry.  Vue 6 was used in Pirates of the Carribean and that got my attention.  I am attracted to Vue's eco-system and their finished product, but nothing I've seen comes close to the amount of flexibility in the TG2 product (for what it does in its class of products) nor have I seen this sort of support we have with TG2 anywhere (for any product ever).

I'm also impressed with TG2's ability to have such a friendly user base with loads of sharing of information as well as files, which I think shows a maturity yet to be followed by other software development worldwide.  The only thing close to this quality of scientific treatment of a software application that I have experienced within the retail world has been John Carmack and his wide open freedom with information and sharing source code.



So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

The Geostation

I've also been considering Vue.   The ecosystems look very attractive, and it has good transparent water too.   I had a play with Vue 5 before, but at the time couldn't get my head around its node networks and surfacing.

The only other thing that is potentially putting me off is whether or not it is stable.   I believe there were some questions about that around the time of its release, maybe e-on have ironed out the majority of those problems since then.

All the best,

Andrew
Andrew Randle
The Geostation

Oshyan

I'm not really qualified to tell you what it's like to actually work with Vue as I've only had limited experience with it. I judge it primarily on its output; on the work that I see people create with it. Most of the images I see from Vue don't really impress me much, but it's really a subjective thing, so if the quality and realism of the output is important to you, the best thing you can do is check out some renders. E-On has some of the better examples on their website and you can find many more on the Renderosity Vue galleries and forums.

Pirates of the Caribbean is one of the very few examples of photorealistic work done with Vue and also one of the few film uses I'm aware of, but if you look at the actual use of Vue it was more limited than you might imagine. Vue was used to create 2D matte backgrounds for some scenes and there was notable post processing performed on the Vue output to make it look as good as it did. It's still important that ILM chose Vue over other products to do those elements, but on the other hand nothing else out there really could have even come close at the time as TG2 wasn't yet available and Digital Domain has control of Engen (their derivative of the "TGD" rendering engine that forms the basis of Terragen 2). For photorealistic purposes no other system even comes close - Bryce, World Builder, etc.

If you want to compare film work, Engen is a reasonably close cousin of TG2 and it was used extensively in Stealth as well as The Flags of Our Fathers, in both cases creating pretty seamless photoreal terrain. TG2 has also been used in commercials and other professional productions, even at this early stage. I think the bottom line though is that it's not as important what a big film studio can do with a product as it is what average artists can do. You also never know how much post processing was performed on something you see in a movie or commercial. So I would pay a lot more attention to the galleries of average users. DeviantArt and Renderosity are both good sources of large, active galleries of people using Vue. You've obviously seen what TG2 can do from the image posts here.

If Vue interests you enough to give it a try, they do offer a demo as well as a "Personal Learning Edition" (PLE) with watermarked output and a Vue logo on the renders. Both give you a good chance to get to know the Vue UI and workflow and see if you like it. There is no doubt that the Vue UI is more intuitive to some people because it's a lot more traditional than TG2. Only you can really say whether you prefer it, of course.

I don't think it's appropriate for me to comment on Vue's stability and similar details, but I think if you look at the forum posts on Renderosity and other public Vue forums over the last few months since the release of Vue 6 you should get a good idea of people's experiences with it, both positive and negative.

I hope that is of some help.

- Oshyan

rcallicotte

Yep.  This is helpful. 

I'm trying to stay objective (as it appears you have done, Oshyan), but the fact is that I like TG2 enough that it will take something particularly and clearly (even rationally) either comparable and easier to use than TG2 or volumes above in terms of quality before I truly consider a switch.  Nevertheless, it's good to keep our eyes open, right?
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

Cyber-Angel

Is it not time to blow Vue of it perch and put Terragen there instead (With the final, commercial version naturally)? 

So it has vegetation which is randomised every time you use it (Eco-Systems) OK so dose World Builder through the use of L-Systems older technique, same idea, maybe Terragen could have one based on Cellular-Automita or some thing.

Regards to you.

Cyber-Angel 

Will

Hi all I'm back! Anyway I have Vue 6 infinite and it works pretty well. Ecosystems is great but displacment eats up a ton of memory and some more complex scenes cuase it to crash. I use it for doing work that involves more realistic vegitation thean Terragen 2 can give at the moment and it fullfills my needs in that respect. Saddly unlike TG it does not have overhangs or Orbit renders. I could awnser anymore questions you have about it too if you want.

Regards,

Will
The world is round... so you have to use spherical projection.

old_blaggard

Hey, Will, welcome back!  How was Russia?
http://www.terragen.org - A great Terragen resource with models, contests, galleries, and forums.

dhavalmistry

"His blood-terragen level is 99.99%...he is definitely drunk on Terragen!"

rcallicotte

Yep.  It's pretty nice.  It's been used to do all kinds of stuff and looks very realistic. 
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

RealUser

@dhavalmistry: Hm, the grass looks nice, clouds too. But this is a rather simple scene and imho doesn't show clearly what Vue6Inf is capable of. Ok, the car and women looks nice, but on the other hand they are rather small and not really easy to rate. ;-)
Markus / RealUser
...................................................................
visit my Renderosity Gallery at
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/browse.php?username=RealUser
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Oshyan

Just in the interest of fair comparison it should be noted that the clouds and sky in that image are entirely photographic. They have just been used as a background for the Vue rendered elements. ;)

- Oshyan

dhavalmistry

I was just trying to show you guys a good vue 6 inf render....

@oshyan....how  can you say the sky and clouds are photographic...I would like to learn the technique
"His blood-terragen level is 99.99%...he is definitely drunk on Terragen!"

Oshyan

Because I know Vue well enough to know it can't do that sky. ;D A very commonly used technique in Vue is to use photographic backgrounds or billboards. This was used heavily in the Vue 5 days before metaclouds came along in Vue 6 to get realistic-looking skies. Even now it is used, as in this case, because metaclouds can't quite achieve that level of realism.

- Oshyan