Best way to use population tool ?

Started by iaminonsiner, January 18, 2019, 04:27:48 pm

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iaminonsiner

Hello !

Another thread for me today ! This time, I want to talk about population.

What is the best way to work with the population tool? I have tested several things today, especially about grass and I often have problems: No textures, flat objects, impossible to have a uniform and coherent rendering, impossible to change the color...

Do you think you can help me?

Here is an example  :

[attach=1]

I think problem it's me, I make test about population just since few days so...

Dune

There's a lot to be learned form using the search function, or dissect other users uploaded objects. But in short; inside the object there are one or more default shaders. Several tabs need to be checked for texture images. Mainly the first coloring the meshes, and the opacity (alpha channel or black and white image for what's to be left out when rendering).
Translucency should be more than 0 a bit for some light passing through the leaves (usually around 0.2-0.5), and for some plants/levaes some reflection (same amount). With or without imported texture maps to detail those tabs.

iaminonsiner

And another concern: To add density to a population, I modify the values in " spacing objects a, b " tab but if I put a small value, my computer becomes very slow while I have a big configuration.... Do you know what the problem is? Maybe I'm using the wrong tool to add / reduce density?

And yet another problem but that's just a display problem:

[attach=1]

I don't know why this window is small like that and I can't resize her

iaminonsiner

Quote from: iaminonsiner on January 19, 2019, 03:52:37 am
And another concern: To add density to a population, I modify the values in " spacing objects a, b " tab but if I put a small value, my computer becomes very slow while I have a big configuration.... Do you know what the problem is? Maybe I'm using the wrong tool to add / reduce density?

And yet another problem but that's just a display problem:

[attach=1]

I don't know why this window is small like that and I can't resize her

Dune

January 19, 2019, 04:17:57 am #4 Last Edit: January 19, 2019, 04:20:13 am by Dune
It depends on the size of the grass/patches, but mostly they should be quite close to eachother, hence a small spacing value. Say 30cm apart (0.3). But over an area of 1x1km that would be a huge population. No wonder it takes long. So confine your pops to just in front of the camera. Say your cam is pointing north at 0/0/50, I'd put a 100x100m pop of grass at 0/0/100 to have no instances behind the camera. Best to be placing pops with an overview from above in the preview. Rotate pop with camera rotaion makes it even more efficient. Grass in the distance can be procedural, just make sure the colors match and the transition is soft. And you can use a distance shader as mask to fade out the grasses pop nearing the 100m in front of the camera.
For big trees spacing of 20-40m is often decent.  So it just depends on what you're planting.

iaminonsiner

Quote from: Dune on January 19, 2019, 04:17:57 am
It depends on the size of the grass/patches, but mostly they should be quite close to eachother, hence a small spacing value. Say 30cm apart (0.3). But over an area of 1x1km that would be a huge population. No wonder it takes long. So confine your pops to just in front of the camera. Say your cam is pointing north at 0/0/50, I'd put a 100x100m pop of grass at 0/0/100 to have no instances behind the camera. Best to be placing pops with an overview from above in the preview. Rotate pop with camera rotaion makes it even more efficient. Grass in the distance can be procedural, just make sure the colors match and the transition is soft. And you can use a distance shader as mask to fade out the grasses pop nearing the 100m in front of the camera.
For big trees spacing of 20-40m is often decent.  So it just depends on what you're planting.


Thank you Dune, It's going to help me.

I was also thinking about the camera, putting grass only in front of my camera, where I do my rendering and not where I don't need it!

iaminonsiner

I would like to take this opportunity to ask another question:

I tried to import an object and put grass on it using the "anchor" and "sit on" window my sphere object but nothing happens, you know where the problem can come from? I tried several objects, adjusted the positions, changed the object but I still have the problem

Dune

The population needs to be exactly where the object is, and about as big. Spacing adjusted so enough instances will be populated onto your object. If it's a 1m radius sphere and you populate trees on it with spacing set to 2m, you won't get any (or with luck, just one), obviously.

iaminonsiner

Quote from: Dune on January 19, 2019, 05:23:13 am
The population needs to be exactly where the object is, and about as big. Spacing adjusted so enough instances will be populated onto your object. If it's a 1m radius sphere and you populate trees on it with spacing set to 2m, you won't get any (or with luck, just one), obviously.


Thank.

I tried something...

[attach=1]

Something's wrong lol

Dune

Did it anchor well to the object? Looks like it isn't anchored.

iaminonsiner

Quote from: Dune on January 19, 2019, 10:34:06 am
Did it anchor well to the object? Looks like it isn't anchored.


Yes, I tried again and still the same result...

Oshyan

It seems you may not have read the initial documentation yet. I highly suggest that you do:
http://planetside.co.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Working_with_Populations

Before loading an object into a populator, make sure it works as a stand-alone, single object and renders correctly. If not, it has no hope of working as a population.

Get a good understanding of the difference between display in the 3D Preview and the Render. None of your images are renders, so it's impossible to say whether the object renders OK or not. The 3D Preview has several modes and not all of them will show textures. I suggest trying the RTP mode as it will give you the most realistic view, closest to a render.

- Oshyan

iaminonsiner

Quote from: Oshyan on January 19, 2019, 04:09:02 pm
It seems you may not have read the initial documentation yet. I highly suggest that you do:
http://planetside.co.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Working_with_Populations

Before loading an object into a populator, make sure it works as a stand-alone, single object and renders correctly. If not, it has no hope of working as a population.

Get a good understanding of the difference between display in the 3D Preview and the Render. None of your images are renders, so it's impossible to say whether the object renders OK or not. The 3D Preview has several modes and not all of them will show textures. I suggest trying the RTP mode as it will give you the most realistic view, closest to a render.

- Oshyan


Thank you Oshyan, I will read that soon.