working in a 32-bit DEM

Started by Dune, August 23, 2019, 01:49:48 am

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Dune

Is it possible to work in those files? I need to alter areas for a project, but in PS it's only a hard B/W image. Unless converted to 16-bit, but then it doesn't give me the right altitudes when imported in TG.
As a workaround I mask certain areas out and add new heights, but I hope for an easier solution.

Any ideas?

WAS

Is it a USGS DEM data set? If so the ArcGIS conversion tool supposedly outputs 32bit float tiff. 

https://pro.arcgis.com/en/pro-app/tool-reference/conversion/dem-to-raster.htm
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Dune

I really don't know. It's a 32-bit floating point tif and looks like attached. Merely seeking a way to be able to copy-paste or draw altitudes and import properly in TG.

WAS

I'm not sure that's been a practical use of high range filetypes. For example I don't know of any image software yet that really handles full-range let alone edit it without dropping to half-range. It's a compositing image format or w/e.
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Tangled-Universe

What if you import it in TG, then export it out of TG in a more suitable format which you can edit?
You could then even paint your changes in a separate layer and only use that layer as heightfield import and merge with the original 32-bit you imported.

Dune

Export is an idea, indeed. Haven't thought of that yet. Thanks.

digitalguru

IMHO OpenExr is the way to go when dealing with these files - it's a great format and you can load it as a heightfield or displacement map and, as you mention, preserves the height information in the map.

If your original file is 32bit tiff I'd convert it to OpenExr and use that, as Tangled Universe suggests you can re-export from TG from the heightfield node.

You can do this in Photoshop, but although PS will edit the file in 32bit, it will export it as 16bit half float, (at least it does in CS6, though AFAIK that hasn't changed)  There's a free PS Plugin called EXR-IO that will save to full 32bit float:

https://www.exr-io.com/

Quote from: Dune on August 23, 2019, 01:49:48 amit's only a hard B/W image

Only because you're seeing values over 1, just add an Exposure Adjustment layer and drag the exposure down and you can non destructively see your terrain. You can then work in PS with the file, though it has to be said PS is still a bit crap at editing 32bit, and your options are limited.

Quote from: Dune on August 23, 2019, 01:49:48 amUnless converted to 16-bit, but then it doesn't give me the right altitudes when imported in TG.

I think you chose one of the tone-mapping options when converting to 16bit in PS - that will normalise the values.

I love that Terragen can output "full range" EXRs for heightfields, other progs like World Machine and Gaea normalise their EXRs and you have to figure out the vertical scaling to get it to work in TG

WAS

Quote from: digitalguru on August 23, 2019, 01:08:00 pmother progs like World Machine and Gaea normalise their EXRs and you have to figure out the vertical scaling to get it to work in TG

There's settings for that xD

Gaea can export it's exact height and load in TG the same. Someone awhile back did a share with default export which causes the normalizing and thus a stout import into TG.  Gaea also now has meter scales.

If it's USGS data (sure looks like it is, it's of Earth), like i said, you can just use ArcGIS Conversion tool to convert it to a normal float tiff, and just edit in Photoshop. Really no real reason to go from Tiff to OpenEXR to Tiff or whatever. Cool TG can do that, though.
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digitalguru

Quote from: WAS on August 23, 2019, 01:17:03 pmGaea can export it's exact height and load in TG the same. Someone awhile back did a share with default export which causes the normalizing and thus a stout import into TG.  Gaea also now has meter scales.
Would interested to know what that setting is :)  - I noticed in the latest version OpenExr has reverted to 16bit.

WAS

Quote from: digitalguru on August 23, 2019, 01:22:36 pm
Quote from: WAS on August 23, 2019, 01:17:03 pmGaea can export it's exact height and load in TG the same. Someone awhile back did a share with default export which causes the normalizing and thus a stout import into TG.  Gaea also now has meter scales.
Would interested to know what that setting is :)  - I noticed in the latest version OpenExr has reverted to 16bit.

They're having some... continuity problems... I guess. Lol Lots of people are mad about 16bit-looking banded geometry in the software, and exporting. Not sure what's going on.  Though OpenEXR is still marked for 32bit in documentation.
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Tangled-Universe

Quote from: WAS on August 23, 2019, 01:32:17 pm
Quote from: digitalguru on August 23, 2019, 01:22:36 pm
Quote from: WAS on August 23, 2019, 01:17:03 pmGaea can export it's exact height and load in TG the same. Someone awhile back did a share with default export which causes the normalizing and thus a stout import into TG.  Gaea also now has meter scales.
Would interested to know what that setting is :)  - I noticed in the latest version OpenExr has reverted to 16bit.

They're having some... continuity problems... I guess. Lol Lots of people are mad about 16bit-looking banded geometry in the software, and exporting. Not sure what's going on.  Though OpenEXR is still marked for 32bit in documentation.

16-bit looking banded, serious??
I was kind of thinking of acquiring a license, but I don't want to run into stupid simple issues like these. That kind of stuff simply must work. Period.

WAS

Quote from: Tangled-Universe on August 23, 2019, 03:17:18 pm
Quote from: WAS on August 23, 2019, 01:32:17 pm
Quote from: digitalguru on August 23, 2019, 01:22:36 pm
Quote from: WAS on August 23, 2019, 01:17:03 pmGaea can export it's exact height and load in TG the same. Someone awhile back did a share with default export which causes the normalizing and thus a stout import into TG.  Gaea also now has meter scales.
Would interested to know what that setting is :)  - I noticed in the latest version OpenExr has reverted to 16bit.

They're having some... continuity problems... I guess. Lol Lots of people are mad about 16bit-looking banded geometry in the software, and exporting. Not sure what's going on.  Though OpenEXR is still marked for 32bit in documentation.

16-bit looking banded, serious??
I was kind of thinking of acquiring a license, but I don't want to run into stupid simple issues like these. That kind of stuff simply must work. Period.

I think it may have to do with the linear/parallel processing or something (I remember Dax mentioning this) and was avoidable, though than someone pointed out it's present in even the default blank projects mountain in soft areas, so yeah I'm not sure. Though I would assume it's going to be fix. There is a lot of rewrites going on that introduce bugs, but they are very quick at rolling out fixes on top of progress of the software.
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digitalguru

August 23, 2019, 03:48:23 pm #12 Last Edit: August 23, 2019, 03:51:24 pm by digitalguru
Quote from: Tangled-Universe on August 23, 2019, 03:17:18 pmI was kind of thinking of acquiring a license, but I don't want to run into stupid simple issues like these. That kind of stuff simply must work. Period.
It is interesting software and has potential I think, but it's not there yet.  The Build Manager in particular seems to change on every update and is the main reason I haven't used it for a major project yet.

It never has had 32bit out in any of the versions I've looked at and when I reported it as a bug, the next version re-labelled it as 16bit  :).

However I got a reply from Quadspinner that a non-normalised output for OpenExr (like Terragen) was in the backlog and would be implemented in the near future. Hoping 32bit could be part of that update.

WAS

Quote from: digitalguru on August 23, 2019, 03:48:23 pmIt never has had 32bit out in any of the versions I've looked at and when I reported it as a bug, the next version re-labelled it as 16bit  :).

Huh. It (was) been right there in their documentation since I've been referring to it. "OpenEXR (32bit)" Though I notice the entire export doc page I had bookmarked doesn't exist anymore... Gives a 404 page.

Does this work for you? https://quadspinner.com/Gaea/Export
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digitalguru

Nope.