Subsurface scattering

Started by Costaud, January 01, 2007, 10:03:48 AM

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Costaud

Hi I'm new here so hello everybody and Happy New Year. I would like to know if subsurface scattering will be integrating in the next (the real one) version of Terragen 2, I saw cool image of two blocks of ice at Planetside site sometime ago.

Tangled-Universe

As far as I know it will be implemented in a future version.
The technology preview doesn't support transparency and/or sss.

Oshyan

Subsurface scattering is planned for the final release of Terragen 2 in 2007.

- Oshyan

sjefen

#3
Any good news on this feature :)

- Terje
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jo

Hi,

I believe the story with subsurface scattering is that it worked to a point but it was both very slow and sensitive to settings changes. Based on this it was decided it wasn't going to be something which could be pursued successfully. There aren't any plans to add it in the near future, but we do have it in mind if there's an opportunity to revisit it.

Regards,

Jo

CCC

Just about every other application has SSS and it is essential to many natural mediums such as leafs, crystals, water, clouds and mud. Some applications use other non-standards of SSS which tends to render faster as well. Do not know which ones in particular but this has been around for a few years so it is nothing new. Vue had had this since version 6. Carrara has had this since version 5 or 6. I don't get it.

Oshyan

Pretty much all of those applications render in a different way than TG2 does. This is something that many people don't realize, but in order to render highly detailed terrain as fast as it does, TG2 works in unique ways. Other applications can be faster at some things, especially things like reflections, object rendering, transparency, etc. because their rendering methods excel at this (raytracing being the most common approach which encompasses all those effects). TG2 does now use raytracing for certain scene elements where it is more effective (e.g. imported 3D objects), but raytracing is not the primary rendering method. Try doing the same level of detail that TG2 accompishes in another app, from space to centimeter ground level. As far as I've heard and seen there really is no other program that can match TG2 in that way, including Vue which seems to slow down quite a lot using procedurals.

In any case partly because of these differences we can't necessarily just take an established rendering technique off the shelf and put it in TG2 and expect it to work correctly (and at a reasonable speed).

- Oshyan

CCC

So this is a render issue then due to Terragen's unique internal system. That is interesting to know.

I had a heck of a time using displacements in Vue 7 but i am not sure if that was greatly improved or not in 8 as it is too heavy on my system to really get into the infinite displacement features. Besides, there is something about terragen's procedurals that really speaks of fine details.

Oshyan

That's probably a gross simplification on my part, but yes as I understand it this is an issue that affects many things, such as "true transparency" (e.g. not just binary, black/white alpha), and refraction quality.

- Oshyan

Kevin F

Quote from: jo on January 16, 2010, 12:10:04 AM
..........Based on this it was decided it wasn't going to be something which could be pursued successfully. There aren't any plans to add it in the near future, but we do have it in mind if there's an opportunity to revisit it.

Regards,

Jo

In which case in might be a good idea to remove this:
http://www.planetside.co.uk/gallery/f/tg2/translucency_test_01.jpg.html

Seth

Quote from: Kevin F on January 16, 2010, 06:39:38 AM

In which case in might be a good idea to remove this:
http://www.planetside.co.uk/gallery/f/tg2/translucency_test_01.jpg.html

isn't that some fake SSS ? i don't remember who did some, some times ago but i think i still have the tgd in my library...
if it is, no need to take that back ^^

Henry Blewer

Subsurface scattering, when done correctly is a calculation intensive program routine. It would probably make I7 3gHz systems as slow at rendering as my Pentium 4 is. It may work with the 48 core CPU that Intel is building, but that is several years away for consumer PC's.
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Hannes

Nevertheless it's a pity that there are no plans to implement SSS in the near future. TG is a landscape generating program and for creating natural things like Ice and snow SSS would be absolutely essential.

domdib

This thread http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=5786.0 seems to suggest it was Matt, and gives a couple of techniques for faking.