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General => Image Sharing => NWDA Iceland Contest => Topic started by: shadow92 on February 02, 2015, 10:53:28 AM

Title: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 02, 2015, 10:53:28 AM
Hi, this is my current WIP of my Icland contest entry, any C&C is welcomed.

(http://s9.postimg.org/5270qu6m3/mo_ice2.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/5270qu6m3/)

stage 1 - defining terrain shape, based on heightfield map I paint in photoshop
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Dune on February 02, 2015, 12:49:05 PM
Good of you to have a go, but you need to work fast, I'm afraid. There's not much I can say at this very premature state. Let's see what some extra surface/texture/displacement shaders will do to this.
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 02, 2015, 03:58:28 PM
Good of you to have a go, but you need to work fast, I'm afraid. There's not much I can say at this very premature state. Let's see what some extra surface/texture/displacement shaders will do to this.

Yes I realize its not the best time to start, unfortunately work didnt allow me to start earlier :D hope I will manage to finish it before, till february 14th is enough time to work on it
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Oshyan on February 02, 2015, 06:58:52 PM
I think (nearly) 2 weeks is enough, if you can invest a good amount of time each day. :) This a decent basis, almost reminds me a bit of the basalt columns that are in some places in Iceland (didn't see any on the shore myself, but there may be some). Curious what you will do with this. Do you have specific reference images you're working off of?

- Oshyan
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: TheBadger on February 02, 2015, 11:15:36 PM
Plenty of time! 8)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 03, 2015, 12:34:22 PM
so, Ive spend now few hours refining terrain shape, but still not satisfied..

(http://s11.postimg.org/iessidvbz/mo_ice3.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/iessidvbz/)

this is what it looks like, and cant get rid of the stepped look of the terrain - any idea? tryed also apply a power fractal over it with small values to create some inequality to the terrain, but its not any better..

about the inspiration, I was slightly inspired by faroe island coastline (yes I know it belongs to the denmark, but its appearnce is totally like Iceland), but Im not trying to copy it.

P.S.: using OverSmooth interpolation method..
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Dune on February 03, 2015, 01:23:48 PM
Did you make your mask in 16-bit grey-scale? I guess not. In 8-bit, you get these steps. Why don't you use a warped simple shape as basic terrain? Such a shape isn't too hard to accomplish. I (as one of the judges) can't help with actual files, but there are sample files and threads about this to be found on this forum.
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 03, 2015, 09:43:29 PM
to be honest, I tryed 16bit grayscale, but realized that for some uncertain reason my Photoshop ignores 16bit mode.. I mean, I set it up to RGB 16bit (tryed also Grayscale 16bit), also I have checked "Image -> Mode -> 16bit" and still my Photoshop document acts like 8bit. I bet Im overlooking some attribute..

Meanwhile I think I found a decent solution - still using 8 bit heightmap (little bit tweaked) and applyed Heightfield Smooth Operator to it, and on top of it I placed Power Fractal v3 with some low values, to add imperfections.

This is looking much closer to the desired result, than previous versions:
(http://s1.postimg.org/updgkjrqz/mo_ice4.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/updgkjrqz/)

Tomorrow I will see what textures and shaders will do to it, maybe I will adjust the lighting slightly, to make it a bit lighter
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Kadri on February 03, 2015, 11:05:54 PM
to be honest, I tryed 16bit grayscale, but realized that for some uncertain reason my Photoshop ignores 16bit mode.. I mean, I set it up to RGB 16bit (tryed also Grayscale 16bit), also I have checked "Image -> Mode -> 16bit" and still my Photoshop document acts like 8bit. I bet Im overlooking some attribute..
...

Just thinking loud.I haven't tried this.
Maybe Photoshop's tools only work in 8 bit (some at least) even if you use a 16 mode.
Would be good to hear from someone who does have more knowledge about this.

You can use and play with EXR' from Terragen but can't make one usable directly from Photoshop maybe.

Anyone?
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: kalwalt on February 04, 2015, 08:19:48 AM
to be honest, I tryed 16bit grayscale, but realized that for some uncertain reason my Photoshop ignores 16bit mode.. I mean, I set it up to RGB 16bit (tryed also Grayscale 16bit), also I have checked "Image -> Mode -> 16bit" and still my Photoshop document acts like 8bit. I bet Im overlooking some attribute..

Meanwhile I think I found a decent solution - still using 8 bit heightmap (little bit tweaked) and applyed Heightfield Smooth Operator to it, and on top of it I placed Power Fractal v3 with some low values, to add imperfections.

This is looking much closer to the desired result, than previous versions:
(http://s1.postimg.org/updgkjrqz/mo_ice4.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/updgkjrqz/)

Tomorrow I will see what textures and shaders will do to it, maybe I will adjust the lighting slightly, to make it a bit lighter


Just one thought. I haven't Photoshop, but maybe the problem is when you are saving your file: i think not all files types support 16 bit, or could be an option when you save that you can choose which type.
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 04, 2015, 09:56:25 AM
Quote
Just one thought. I haven't Photoshop, but maybe the problem is when you are saving your file: i think not all files types support 16 bit, or could be an option when you save that you can choose which type.

nope, problem isnt there - my PS document acts like 8bit already during the work. I followed simple tutorial where the guy placed levels adjustment on top of gradient to make it single-color, and then placed another levels with opposite values and it was supposed to return to the original appearance, but in my case it created stripped-gradient, like it would in 8bit document

Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Dune on February 04, 2015, 12:14:01 PM
If you have an 8-bit greyscale mask and set it to 16-bit, there won't be much difference, because the stepping remains as it was. You should work in 16-bit from the start, or after converting to 16-bit, do some blurring to make the gradients smooth.
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 04, 2015, 12:38:21 PM
I think now its getting somewhere already.. used multiple camera projections for the textures

(http://s16.postimg.org/gdlc5rsa9/mo_ice10.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/gdlc5rsa9/)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 10, 2015, 07:48:34 PM
after few days, here is an update:
(http://s29.postimg.org/ebys1lmgj/Untitled.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/ebys1lmgj/)

decided to make completely different scene, didnt like the first one. This is a rough look, next I will add a clouds, some little pieces of ice on the lake and some other slight adjustments.

Just a few questions about the rules:
1 - is adding a lens flare in Photoshop allowed? Rules are saying "techniques that simulate typical lens effects" are permitted,and I just want to make sure lens flares are fitting to this category
2 - is creating a fake HDR effect in PS allowed? Not 100% sure I want to simulate this effect, but Im considering that option, so I just want to be sure its not considered as overly-enhancing adjustment
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Oshyan on February 10, 2015, 11:02:35 PM
I like your new direction, good work!

Not sure about the answers to your questions, though I suspect that HDR processing would, at least, be "too much". Just my opinion though, hopefully Danny will clarify. Since there's not much time left, probably best to email him directly. Link should be on the NWDA site.

- Oshyan
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Danny on February 11, 2015, 01:05:54 PM
after few days, here is an update:
(http://s29.postimg.org/ebys1lmgj/Untitled.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/ebys1lmgj/)

decided to make completely different scene, didnt like the first one. This is a rough look, next I will add a clouds, some little pieces of ice on the lake and some other slight adjustments.

Just a few questions about the rules:
1 - is adding a lens flare in Photoshop allowed? Rules are saying "techniques that simulate typical lens effects" are permitted,and I just want to make sure lens flares are fitting to this category
2 - is creating a fake HDR effect in PS allowed? Not 100% sure I want to simulate this effect, but Im considering that option, so I just want to be sure its not considered as overly-enhancing adjustment

1) The Photoshopped lens flare is allowed because TG has no way to internally generate this, this is a typical lens effect so PW is the only way to achieve this. So yes to that
2) Subtle HDR is allowed but I must mention that over doing this effect may be judged 'overly-enhanced', This is something that needs to be determined on a  image by image bias of course. That said, it is allowed just use your best judgment and don't go overboard with it and you shouldn't have a problem. If there is an issue with over processing, we will ask you to resubmit the image minus the HDR. We are willing to work with you, just be mindful of the timeline. Any additional questions shoot me an email to the address listed below.
Danny
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: kalwalt on February 11, 2015, 01:42:42 PM
I like the last image you did. :) Imo you should focus on the landscape itself: could be interesting, as you said, in such a view some little pieces of ice in the lake and on the beach; don't worry too much on lens flares or other postwork effects, if the image will need it you will add after.  ;)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 11, 2015, 06:59:30 PM
thanks for the kind words  :)
this is what I got so far, I think its like 90% complete. Added clouds, pieces of ice, few rocks, forrest in the BG and the pier. Last thing to add is a fishing boat parked near the pier.

(http://s30.postimg.org/jd2odvgbh/Untitled.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/jd2odvgbh/)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: inkydigit on February 11, 2015, 07:23:08 PM
I like the way this is coming together... the jetty/pier texture seems a bit too bright, (?) ...maybe add some grunge with some extra power fractals?
the sky is also looking great... looking forward to seeing the next one...
cheers
Jason
:)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 13, 2015, 11:36:32 AM
thanks for your advice, I reworked the pier and also darkened a texture and added some dirt/moss to it.
Also fishing boat was added and a fishnet on the pier. I adjusted camera position/rotation as well, to achieve a better composition

now I think this might be done. Now just tweak the quality settings and make a slight postprocessing before submiting.

this is raw render
(http://s16.postimg.org/3nakyhs8x/Iceland_q06.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/3nakyhs8x/)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Oshyan on February 14, 2015, 04:57:46 AM
Looks very good! With a higher quality render you should have less noise in the atmosphere and that'll help a lot. The only other little thing you might look at, if you have time (though I imagine you may already be doing your final render :D ) is the snowline on the left. Might be better if it were a little more broken up, a little less regular. Not noisy, just more patchy perhaps. Something to experiment with...

- Oshyan
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 14, 2015, 11:44:20 AM
Actually I didnt submitted it yet, and this is exactly why - I wanted to hear some opinions, maybe someone spots at the last moment any issue I overlooked, like you did.
Yes, the atmosphere noise needed some tweaking, this one below looks better :) Still is there some minor noise, but on the other hand I somehow like it, reminds me that digital camera grain (especially when pointed against sun), which I think slightly adds feeling of realism to the image rather than overly smoothed and too perfect render.
About the snowline, I now played with it a little bit, but Im not that much familiar with Fractal Breakup node, and there is no time for random attempts with values. So I just adjusted it like this, breaks a snow surface a little bit.
Here you can see both raw render and final result, which is just slightly adjusted and I like it like this :)
Now I submitted it do Dannys email listed ant NWDAs site (thats where I have to submit it, right?)

RAW:
(http://s21.postimg.org/4qs36vcab/Iceland_Render.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/4qs36vcab/)

EDITED:
(http://s7.postimg.org/dq3sthqrr/Iceland_Render.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/dq3sthqrr/)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: kalwalt on February 14, 2015, 01:37:49 PM
Nice image @shadow92, of course you can yet improve it, but this could take forever, at certain point we must stop! good luck for the contest! :)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: inkydigit on February 14, 2015, 01:48:08 PM
Great job!
Well done and good luck!
Cheers
Jason
:)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: shadow92 on February 14, 2015, 04:58:13 PM
thank you guys both , I appreciate it :) :) :)

As you say, kalwalt, there is also room for improvement, its my bad I didnt start earlier, but nevermind now :) Im glad I made it before deadline and Im glad you like it :)

Thanks and good luck to you both, too ;)
Title: Re: My Iceland contest entry
Post by: Oshyan on February 14, 2015, 10:25:02 PM
Yes, I think this looks good. Well done!

- Oshyan