do the other terrain programs use vector maps?

[TheBadger]

Hi,

do the other erosion programs you guys use allow for vectors in and out?
And of those, which are currently available for OS X?

Would like to update may knowledge of where things are at.

Thanks

[Oshyan]

Erosion in 99% of cases is fundamentally a raster (finite resolution) process, so the output is almost always raster (bitmap) maps.

- Oshyan

[TheBadger]

but once the terrain is "done" in any of those programs, then couldn't you do a top down vector render like we can here? I mean, I guess I don't see why how a terrain was made would effect saving out a vector. unless you are saying that the erosion is not actual displacement in those other programs? Just looked like it was from the images I have seen (render galleries), but I know that can't really tell me how something is being when some one is working.

[TheBadger]

going to have to find a erosion solution for this current contest

[Oshyan]

Oh, I misunderstood. You were talking about *vector displacement* maps. In that case there's no need because that's *only* useful (vs. regular displacement/heightmaps) if there are *overhangs*. There are no volumetric erosion models that create overhangs that I am aware of (no, not even Daniil's). So the output is fundamentally planar, i.e. does not need vector displacement to represent the data.

You're a bit obsessed with vector displacement, eh? In this case it's simpler than that.

- Oshyan

[TheBadger]

You're a bit obsessed with vector displacement, eh? In this case it's simpler than that.

What can I say, it works perfectly. just will be nice to now that I can go to all of the little helper programs (WM and such) as well with vector. Its very efficient imo.

But really, I need to get some erosion. I can spend money on it finely if I have to. Free would be nice though. But one of the paid softs will do if need be.

Does not have to be global. I am working on 4kx4kM area, no more. And generally, I don't care much about the planet anymore unless from high orbit or space. Im pretty close to the ground most of the time these days.

[Dune]

I understand that you want erosion on a terrain with overhangs. I don't really know what Daniil's shader does to those. Perhaps if you mask them to a minor percentage, they won't be eroded away totally, and you can enhance them again after erosion?

[TheBadger]

well thats the beauty. I can do it in any order at any time. And go back and forth as often as I want with just the one file, little mess no fuss. So does not matter too much to me if erosion will work on over hangs or not. Just need to get some in. But thats the prob then, Daniil's shader will not be available for a while if at all.

WM is win only still I think. Cant remember the name of the new Geo control?.. Ahh, lol world creator I think. Ill google.

Anyway, if it reads and exports vector maps, then it will be fun to see what I can get with as little fuss as could be possible.


Oshyan,
I think you were telling me that I don't need vector because I can just add maps to the TG project when working. But what I was curious about is if I can basically bake those maps into my master vector map, and then for all things, just have that one vector file to take into TG for the final colors and micro displacements. My preference for the sake of experimenting, is to have as little amount of files in my project folder as possible.

I understand that, that may not be in my best interests all the time. But I want to know the inside out of this workflow, since I lobbied for it so much.

I think that for much of the time, I won't need to make any changes to the erosion. And I think that there will be some benefit to having it baked in. I can just save a edition without the erosion in my archives if I would want, which I probably should... much like I should save incremental versions of my TG work, that I never remember to save

Make more sense now what I am trying to do?

[Oshyan]

No, I was telling you that you don't need Vector because erosion does not work in 3D/volumetric/with overhangs. So if you're doing erosion, you will lose overhangs, period. Thus World Machine, World Creator, etc. do not read nor could they do anything useful with Vector Displacement Maps. Use standard displacement/heightmaps.

I still don't really understand the rest of what you're saying here. I think you're overcomplicating things with the idea of Vector Displacement in this case. The only apps that really use it are sculpting apps, and general 3D apps to some degree as well.

- Oshyan

[TheBadger]

OK, but I understand now. My question was ultimately about work order.

That you explained the erosion systems do not work on overhangs is good to know. I don't think that I had payed attention to it before if someone already wrote about it. Anyway, the places that I want to have erosion, don't have overhangs anyway, in this project.

Thanks.