PRISM

Started by TheBadger, June 07, 2013, 03:15:15 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

TheBadger

#165
Thats not what I was saying. I was saying adding more mess to a mess, just makes a bigger mess.

Why do you think new parties would be more honest? politics is politics. It would just be liars by a new name.
The two parties have to be fixed before anything else is added. And if we fix them, then their wont be much of a need for more big parties.

I know historically in the US 3rd parties manage to survive only as long as the problem they formed to solve lingers. Once the issue/problem is resolved they fall away on their own. Or they are told no by the people and they fall away.
Traditionally what happens is if a 3rd voice gains majority appeal (with-in) one of the parties, than that voice will come to dominate the party, it effectively means our two party system is unlimited. But the problem is it can happen very slowly. Much slower than the people with a issue often like. But in the last 20 years it has been happing faster and faster.
Progressivism and libertarianism are an example, then there is the green movement just to name 3. All of which are finding their place in the parties. They are called a caucus here.



I am aware of your love for the EU Martin, and over all dislike of the US, or at least the US government (some of that dislike i share right now). But all I can tell you is there are not many people in the US who want to be like Europe. Somethings some people want, and try to do, like one nation or another in Europe.
But no one really wants us to change to be more like Any country in the EU.

There are 300 million people here, and most of them came from Europe. How many try to get back? Not many. Yet we still take in a large number of Europeans every year despite our current political and economic mess. I think that says a lot.
The region I live in is mostly people of German, norwegian and Scandinavian decent. And they are rather happy not returning to the mother lands ;)

The solution to Americas problem are not in following Europe, of that I am sure. And I am also sure if the American people can force a fix to our current problems, we will be back on top in no time.
One way or another we will have to face all of the issues in this conversation and all the others, here in the US.
The trick is fixing things without bloodshed or chaos. But who knows? Bloodshed may happen.

Our system is fine, the problem is the people running it. And that I believe can be fixed. However, Europe's problems are another story. You have all of the parties you could ever have room for, and there is still tons of unhappiness and injustice, poverty, violence and general distrust of those governments. which is why so many still come here.
Granted its a smaller number than the 50-70s. But still a lot of people.

I except your critique of the American government (even the American people a bit), but your pride for the EU perplexes me.

*Edit
when I said enemies in my last post. I meant anyone trying to undermine/take away my liberty. Or any political leader who lies to me. I view those people as more dangerous than Al Qaeda. So yes, my enemies.
And no, there is no grey area. I don't care what peoples reasons are for wanting to take away liberty.
It has been eaten.

efflux

The American system is the only system or at least the best we know of. Americans haven't stuck with it. That's the problem. What amazes me about Europe is the continual acceptance of tyranny after tyranny. Choosing to give up your national currency was the biggest disaster. There is no France, no Germany or any of these countries any more. They do not exist and you won't be allowed to even fly those flags. If you think this is over the top, it's in the Lisbon Treaty. The intention is to destroy those national cultures. The destruction of the different languages is one of their biggest goals because each countries different language defines the culture more than anything.

AP

Humanity does not need Government anymore. We should be past this and focus on Voluntarianism and give up the idea that we need a monopoly of force, fraud and coercion, AKA Government. There are already Universal Golden Rules that we were taught as Children and from Religion that would serve well in a Stateless Society. Do not harm others, share, do not steel and so on. Somehow, all Governments have forgot this but then it would not be Government, would it? The Marketplace of ideas, localization and privatization is what is essential as well. The very idea that we should be controlling and manipulating others has to die.

efflux

I don't think we are at a stage where no government can work because we need people to represent what we want done on a larger scale. The idea of no states is very dangerous at the moment because that is exactly what the elites want. Those state governments are still to some degree representative of the people. Global corporations aren't. We need national governments to cooperate and not be cooperating through private corporations which is exactly what the UN and various banking corporations such as the IMF are. People from different countries have different cultures and that needs different representation. The globalists want people all amalgameted into some kind of global culture that they control. Unfortunately a lot of culture is totally controlled by people at the top. Just look at music as an example.

efflux

It's not necessarily the systems of government we have, it's the people in there. The US is the best example. Nothing wrong with that system of government if the people were correct. The people currently in government in most countries are largely psychopathic and do what benefits them which is to act as banking puppets. There is a serious lack of judging these people's charactor. It's obvious some of these leaders are totally unsuitable so why do we keep voting for them.

efflux

"The homeless are what you step over when you come out of the opera."

- The "Right Honourable" Sir George Young

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_George_Young,_6th_Baronet

Why is this guy still in politics with comments like that? Maybe it was a joke. I don't know but who makes jokes like that? People really do deserve what's coming to them.

TheBadger

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

So how is everyone enjoying their shit sandwich? MMMMmmmm is good, yes?
Almost as good as the butt hurt?

Just remember that we discussed petroleum jelly at the beginning of this thread. Most stores will sell it too you. Don't be embarrassed or ashamed to plop that jar down on the table, look the sales clerk directly in the eye and declare with a loud bold voice "LET THE BUTT HURT BEGIN!".
Its perfectly normal to have a politician or two (with a side of army general) lodged deeply in your back side. No judgements here on that stuff. Liberty people, personal liberty!
If any one gives you any trouble about the people who have taken up residence in your bum, you just call the ACLU! ITS YOUR ABSOLUTE HUMAN RIGHT, to bend over and take it!
And if anyone  says anything upsetting about the fact that one of the people up your ass is a black man, well you know who to call. You just call the reverend Jesse Jackson, or Al sharpton! The'll make everything better. They always make everything better.


Ok, Im done! No really thats the last of it for me, I really got it out of my system now. REally!... Probably.
But Im not going to promise to stop posting images and gifs I think are funny. Thats just too much to ask of me.
It has been eaten.

yossam


Upon Infinity


AP

Quote from: efflux on July 18, 2013, 09:34:43 PM
I don't think we are at a stage where no government can work because we need people to represent what we want done on a larger scale. The idea of no states is very dangerous at the moment because that is exactly what the elites want. Those state governments are still to some degree representative of the people. Global corporations aren't. We need national governments to cooperate and not be cooperating through private corporations which is exactly what the UN and various banking corporations such as the IMF are. People from different countries have different cultures and that needs different representation. The globalists want people all amalgameted into some kind of global culture that they control. Unfortunately a lot of culture is totally controlled by people at the top. Just look at music as an example.

No, not yet but at some point we should be able to represent ourselves as free thinking individuals with universal morals and not have some centralized power telling us how we should live and think. No, the elites want more Government, not less. More power, they need us, our taxes and labor. I highly doubt everyone all of a sudden will become a berserk killer just because Government fades away one day. I think people want more peace then anything else. It is Government that want's war and confusion. Lets we the people and the market place of ideas and technology figure it out.

AP

Quote from: efflux on July 18, 2013, 09:44:18 PM
It's not necessarily the systems of government we have, it's the people in there. The US is the best example. Nothing wrong with that system of government if the people were correct. The people currently in government in most countries are largely psychopathic and do what benefits them which is to act as banking puppets. There is a serious lack of judging these people's charactor. It's obvious some of these leaders are totally unsuitable so why do we keep voting for them.

But what is Government? A centralized monopoly of force, fraud and coercion. It always has been. Has any form of Government in the entire history of human kind ever worked? Government always will grow. Government itself is not correct. Why vote at all? Replace the cancer without removing it entirely. We know Anarchy works. Ireland had it for a thousand years, Iceland in the Med evil period had it. Even Tolkein's Hobbiton is a fine example of Anarchy. Tolkein himself was an Anarchist. I know it is a fantasy but I sighted historical examples. You give knowledge to the people and gently allow them to rethink there ideas that we somehow need a centralized force of men at work.