Obj node attached to unrelated parts shader

Started by Asterlil, January 30, 2020, 06:27:57 pm

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Asterlil

Hi everybody,

I have two objects, a kayak and a motorboat in a rather large scene, lots of other objects and populations, but these two have me puzzled. You can see how they appear in the attached images. Both objects have been laundered through PoseRay. What's more, I'm not actually having any problems working with the motorboat object, adjusting its shaders, position or whatever. It just bugs me that this is happening...  :(

Advice and criticism needed.

Asterlil

I was wrong about there being no connection. If I move the kayak, the motorboat moves accordingly.

Dune

So they are two objects, and you put the boat inside the kayak... interesting. And it's on purpose, I suppose, just to have them move synchronously?

Tangled-Universe

If you click on any of the + -symbols next to kayak you will see motorboat.obj show up eventually.
In the end .tgd files are XML-files and structure/reference of elements or objects is very flexible.
It's just organised text references.
You basically told TG that the motorboat.obj is organised to be inside the kayak object, but besides the discrepancy in the way that information is presented there's nothing noteworthy happening or noteworthy of doing so. If you open this project again a few years later, this will have you puzzled again :P

Quote from: Dune on January 31, 2020, 02:20:56 amSo they are two objects, and you put the boat inside the kayak... interesting. And it's on purpose, I suppose, just to have them move synchronously?

No unfortunately "tethering" of objects this way does not work. Tethering of objects has been requested a few times in the past.
In this setup the coordinates of motorboat.obj will still decide its position.

Dune


Tangled-Universe

Oh yes you're right... Interesting!
That would be great that I'm wrong.

So what happens if we place populations inside an object?

Hannes

Holy cow, is this really some sort of accidental grouping? I'll have to test this immediately!

Hannes

Hmm, I just tested it and imported two objects. I moved one object into the shader network of the other one. I had to reset the preview until the object inside the other one appeared in the preview again. It renders correctly, but if I move the first object, the second one stays in place. >:( 
Asterlil, is there something different in your setup?

Tangled-Universe

Quote from: Hannes on January 31, 2020, 08:20:26 amHmm, I just tested it and imported two objects. I moved one object into the shader network of the other one. I had to reset the preview until the object inside the other one appeared in the preview again. It renders correctly, but if I move the first object, the second one stays in place. >:(
Asterlil, is there something different in your setup?

That's exactly what I thought should happen and would happen.
Would still be interesting to see I'm wrong, since I share your enthusiasm for these possibilities.

cyphyr

Yes, the first thing I tested this morning and I couldn't get the grouping/parenting/tethering to work.

One of Terragens long requested features.
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Hannes

So, Asterlil, what did you do, to make the motorboat move with the kayak?

Asterlil

I did not do this on purpose, I assure you all! I imported the kayak, checked all the shaders as usual, then imported the motorboat, and found the situation as described above.

This morning I deleted them both, and imported the motorboat with no problems. Then I imported the kayak. Again, no anomalies. Then I imported another object, and lo! It got stuck in with the kayak's shaders. So the kayak is the problem. It has a strange shader called "None" that I have been unable to track down in Blender (in uvimages list, regular materials list,or orphan data). You can't delete materials in PoseRay. I'm going to throw the model obj out and start from scratch because that "None means there's something I haven't attached a material to in the blender file, and I can't find the guilty mesh.  >:(

Incidentally, I am having a wretched time with the net today, with timeouts, drop outs, and assorted other errors. I live in a nursing facility with a public wifi whose password hasn't been changed in 7 years. Seven years! We're probably being used to launch all those denial of service attacks I'm hearing about. :-\ So I apologize for any tardy responses.

Oshyan

I would guess some kind of node naming collision is occurring due to the shader(s) named "none" and it's somehow causing an odd entanglement. Surprising result though. Do both objects show up in previews and/or renders, and both move together and render in the new position once moved?

- Oshyan

Asterlil

The kayak is acting as some kind of parent to the next object to be imported. Obj #2 can be moved independently, but any translation of the kayak causes the child on to move with it.

And both objects show up in renders.

cyphyr

Could you share a stripped down tgd, we can easily replace with proxy objects,
It woulb be facinating to get to the bottom of this.

by the way if you open up the tgd file in note pad or similar and do a search for "None" you should be able to delete the offending node.
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Ryzen 9 3900X @3.79Ghz, 64Gb (TG4 benchmark 6:20)
i7 5930K @3.5Ghz, 32Gb (TG4 benchmark 13.44)