Old times , new times - UPDATED

Started by Kadri, October 19, 2009, 11:56:54 am

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Kadri

October 19, 2009, 11:56:54 am Last Edit: June 17, 2011, 11:48:26 pm by Kadri

Edit : I could finish it at last !
(I will post other images on the 2. page on this thread here)



The subject name and picture is not realy exceptional but anyway....

I made this in 1982. Unfortunately i could not find the original.This is a fotocopy.
1-2 weeks earlier i wanted to make a glacier picture. But there was another project here.
Because of this (and that it was harder then i thought  ;D ) i want to make this old picture in TG2.
In the early 90's i made it with  3d studio (not max...dos). İf i can find the avi i will upload it here. But you lose nothing , if i can't find it...realy :)

İf you find this interesting in some way please remind me every once in a while to finish this (But not this 1-3 day please.I am ill right now).
İf i can model the ship (again :( ) the rest is not so hard. But i want to make 2-3 other versions too.

Cheers.

Kadri.

littlecannon

You've got me interested. Star wars influence on the ship there?
cheers,
Simon.
I just need to tweak that texture a bit more...

Kadri

October 19, 2009, 02:38:12 pm #2 Last Edit: October 19, 2009, 03:52:05 pm by Kadri
Quote from: littlecannon on October 19, 2009, 02:29:24 pm

You've got me interested. Star wars influence on the ship there?



Absolutely :)

But at those times and now i don't like copying other people works. But sometimes you can't escape even if you want to...
I was 20 at the times. In those age it's even harder.

Kadri.

Zairyn Arsyn

i see it too,

the crashed space craft looks like a cross between a Y-wing and a B-wing star fighter imo.
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Kadri

October 19, 2009, 03:16:55 pm #4 Last Edit: October 19, 2009, 03:32:04 pm by Kadri
Quote from: zaai999 on October 19, 2009, 02:46:05 pm
...the crashed space craft looks like a cross between a Y-wing and a B-wing star fighter imo.


Yes :)

But please look here : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Val%C3%A9rian_and_Laureline   especially  at the   "  Legacy  " section.

How much original are we? Can you make anything that is realy completely original?
I had influences from comics too.    " L'Ambassadeur Des Ombres "   http://www.noosfere.org/mezieres/pages/val/albums.htm    brings many memories today in my mind. This was before Star wars...1975 i think . İ don't like the caricature side. But there are realy good albums there...

And of course there are other influences from comics, films etc....Maybe i should make a web site ...hmm

Edit: I forget to mention. I draw  comics too. In 1985. Only 3 issues.
       Then i saw that is was better to go to the university here. In your country it may not be the same of course :)

Kadri.

Kadri

October 25, 2009, 11:54:34 am #5 Last Edit: October 25, 2009, 03:27:54 pm by Kadri
Guys I need your help.

Searched the forum but could not find a answer.İf you know it i would realy pleased.

I begun modeling the space ship in Lightwave. I don't like modeling and ı am not very good at it . After a while i thought i should check if there are problems.  There are!

I think this is because of the very near polygons and vertices (to close?) . But what should i do? I have the free v. of TG2 is there a way to do this with this v.?

With "do ray traced shadows" (in the render tab) and without are different problems.

AA is 3 , Detail is 1 the other in order are 3  , 3  ,  8   the two boxes checked.

Looked  here and other topics   :   http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=6943.0

I used Poseray and Povray to control and make the obj. There aren't any textures yet. In Lightwave , Poseray and Povray i don't see this problem.
I otimized the object a bit and the faults are not so much as in the beginning,but they are not gone completely. I wonder if this would be seen with textures?

Please help :)

Not: Should I post this to the other discussion sections?

Kadri.

TheBlackHole

Hey, you're doing a LOT better than I could. Anim8or exports as .obj for Terragen, and if I reopen the .obj, I find that Anim8or has wiped out my materials!  >:( And in TG, they render black! ~>:-(
They just issued a tornado warning and said to stay away from windows. Does that mean I can't use my computer?

Kadri

October 25, 2009, 03:18:19 pm #7 Last Edit: October 25, 2009, 03:26:22 pm by Kadri
Thanks.
I don't have Lightwave at home and this make things not easy. I am waiting for a solution. I searched for ngons double polygons or vertices. The object is made of  triangles.
Everything seams as it should be ,for me at least. But that doesn't mean much :) Is this my fault or are there some things i should know i am curious.

Edit: TheBlackHole , have you seen the topics with poseray? It can be helpfull for you.

Kadri.

TheBlackHole

October 25, 2009, 03:38:41 pm #8 Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 12:42:36 am by Oshyan
Quote from: Kadri on October 25, 2009, 03:18:19 pm
Thanks.
I don't have Lightwave at home and this make things not easy. I am waiting for a solution. I searched for ngons double polygons or vertices. The object is made of  triangles.
Everything seams as it should be ,for me at least. But that doesn't mean much :) Is this my fault or are there some things i should know i am curious.

Edit: TheBlackHole , have you seen the topics with poseray? It can be helpfull for you.

Kadri.

I'm pretty sure PoseRay has nothing to do with Anim8or. I found that Anim8or wiped out my materials when I decided to export that model as .3ds for Celestia. I'm going to go flame at the Anim8or forum...
They just issued a tornado warning and said to stay away from windows. Does that mean I can't use my computer?

Henry Blewer

Lightwave defaults to single sided polygons. Check to see that double sided is set as the default.
Another thing I have noticed is that Terragen 2 like triangles for surfaces. If there are quadrangular surfaces in Lightwave, they need to be subdivided into triangular surfaces. There could also be difficulty with surface normal smoothing. If the vertexes of the smooth (rounded) parts are connected to the flat surfaces, the smoothing continues onto the flat areas. This causes render errors sometimes.
Last, here I go again, load the object into Blender. Then export it using my method in the tutorial I uploaded. (Skip the part about modeling, it may or may not help) Terragen 2 likes wavefront obj files. I tried using Lightwave lwo objects, but did not have much success.

http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=7840.0

I hope this helps.
http://flickr.com/photos/njeneb/
Forget Tuesday; It's just Monday spelled with a T

Kadri

Quote from: njeneb on October 25, 2009, 05:49:46 pm
Lightwave defaults to single sided polygons. Check to see that double sided is set as the default....


I will change this (i think they are one sided) .

Quote from: njeneb on October 25, 2009, 05:49:46 pm
...Another thing I have noticed is that Terragen 2 like triangles for surfaces. If there are quadrangular surfaces in Lightwave, they need to be subdivided into triangular surfaces...


The surfaces are triangular . But the last  ones.

Quote from: njeneb on October 25, 2009, 05:49:46 pm
...There could also be difficulty with surface normal smoothing. If the vertexes of the smooth (rounded) parts are connected to the flat surfaces,
the smoothing continues onto the flat areas. This causes render errors sometimes....


This may be the problem.If so i am realy in trouble...hmm...Is there a way to fix  this?

I will look in your tutorial . But this time  with more attention . You know what i mean  ;D

Thanks , njeneb :)

Kadri.


Kadri

October 26, 2009, 12:59:24 am #11 Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 01:49:01 am by Kadri
I made a new topic here : http://forums.planetside.co.uk/index.php?topic=7862.new;topicseen#new

I have not exhausted every way yet. I see objects without problems here in the forum. I will try other ways and make the ship from scratch and try Njeneb's advices .
So at first i think it is my fault. Will see if it is or not (The realy big problems are mine i think)...

But , TG2 must handle objects realy better than this and more formats would not be bad :) .

Kadri.

Henry Blewer

A decade ago, in Lightwave Magazine, they had a tutorial on building some object. The author recommended that smooth faces and flat faces be separated by using different vertexes, even if they occupy the same space. Since then I have modeled nearly everything this way. It has to do with the way the surface normals iare calculated; the calculation carries across the entire surface when using phong or gourard smooth shading.
In Sculpt Animate 4D, if the surface wrapped at too tight an angle with very small distance between the vertexes, the phong shader would give up. This left holes in the objects. Real 3D had the same issue.
There's the history of blah blah blah. Not much help.
Could you send me the model? I would like to see how it is constructed, maybe something will knock me in the head 'there's the problem'.
http://flickr.com/photos/njeneb/
Forget Tuesday; It's just Monday spelled with a T

Kadri

October 26, 2009, 10:04:24 am #13 Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 10:14:36 am by Kadri
Njeneb , i can guarantee you it is bad constructed  ;D
Like i said, i am not good at modeling . But i made a litlle test with the object that you see here atached .

What worries me is this . I made more tests than you see here. All of them were problematic.

I like TG2. But there are plenty of room to improve. It is a complex software. The first TG2 came out  i tried it and it crashed all the time and i give up on it for a while.
Now  it is very stable and with more options.

The object handling should more or less like in the other 3d aplications. I know that Planetside knows all of the problems and maybe in 1-2 weeks we will many nice additions.
And i am not a man who crys loud at the first opportunity. Like i said most of the problems and even maybe all of them are my fault :)

And i use the free version. The least people i like are the one who complain on free things.
I always write in fear  of misunderstanding . If i say anything i mean it in the constructive point of view ( i try at least ).

Anyway..  :D

Kadri.

Mandrake

That test looks fine to me, if your pondering that chop in the shadow, it's no doubt a tg2 problem and the soft shadow could help clear it up.
But cyphyr gave you the best advice so far, also, make sure all your normals are facing the same direction.