Author Topic: Post-Glacial  (Read 13926 times)

Offline Dune

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Post-Glacial
« on: October 09, 2014, 06:17:06 AM »
I'm not too keen on the 'composition' but I'm bound to a certain area (same POV at all times) to be visualized in different eras. This is supposed to become a spring post glacial (weichselien) river system (permafrost still present) , but I would like some input from guys who know tundras. I hope it's possible to get some more (color/texture) diversity in the rather even ground area, to make it less dull. Maybe 'islands' of certain vegetation are possible, I really don't know...
The crop is on final size but not the highest quality (book spread).

Offline Dune

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2014, 08:07:42 AM »
OK, it seems my last post got wiped off somehow, maybe too large. Here's another attempt at trying to simulate a 2x3km area of post-glacial tundra-steppe-like environment. Crowberry patches and flowers and grass in between, etc. There will be herds of animals in there, later. And some low POV detail renders, which will no doubt arouse more interest  ;)

Any comment?

Offline masonspappy

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2014, 10:09:08 AM »
I'm really intrigued by the tributaries in some of the backgrounds.  May I ask how you achieved that affect? (just a hint maybe?)

TaroTaoYin

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2014, 10:20:40 AM »
Excellent. I like you comment. It good to do that.

Offline Dune

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2014, 12:23:04 PM »
Just a painted mask in Photoshop, as easy as pie.

Offline Dune

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2014, 02:28:30 PM »
OK, next version, but I noticed I forgot to mask the procedural lilies out of the moving waters. Now I need to make believable cattails in the swampy lakes...
I also noticed some nasty bumps, even when flattening the snow areas, but that was because the terrain heights (derived from GISdata) was translated into an 8-bit greyscale. I now made that 16-bit, faded a little et voila, it's gone.

Offline choronr

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2014, 03:40:23 PM »
One cannot appreciate the magnitude and details of these images until you magnify and scroll through the compositions. Fine work Ulco.

Offline Kadri

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2014, 04:34:49 PM »
Looks great Ulco.

Offline Oshyan

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2014, 03:29:31 AM »
Very nice tundra texturing overall Ulco. Lots of detail, all the areas and terrain types one would expect. I think the procedural lilies/water plants are fairly effective, but masking them by shore/depth might be good, and also I think there should be less of them (or only at the edges) in the moving water in the river network in the background. Otherwise it all looks great though.

- Oshyan

Offline Dune

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2014, 06:56:08 AM »
Thanks, guys.
@Oshyan: earlier post:
Quote
but I noticed I forgot to mask the procedural lilies out of the moving waters.
and; you may be right, but I have to wait what the scientists say. They are VERY picky and sent me comprehensive lists of species associations and environment specifications. But I hope not too picky, because this is largely procedural, and I wouldn't like to paint all sorts of masks for every species. The stagnant remains of what was a tributary as well, may consist of 'islands' of plants, or should be grown over totally, we'll see. One thing I can imagine is that the trees can be more, but clumped in depressions, and the willows in the tributaries als clumped more.
These rocks are max 3m and were later used by early settlers to build our famous 'hunebedden' (dolmens).

EDIT: and a part of the stagnant waters (with grass clumps)
« Last Edit: October 12, 2014, 06:58:53 AM by Dune »

Offline Hannes

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2014, 10:09:41 PM »
Wow, great work, Ulco!

Offline ndeewolfwood

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2014, 12:35:03 AM »
Interresting project Dune.

In many aspect it's remind me Svalbard in summer.

You put almost every ecosystem we could find in this archipelago between June and September.

I don't have a large experience about tundra and post-glacial environment but I've some comments according to what i saw maybe it can help you. 

* threes are rare, tiny or non existants ! but there's an incredible low level life in tundra (mostly moss compose by different vegetals species)
This moss parts are really really thick and compact. It's like a 60 cm thick mattress full of water. glaciaal-test-3E-crop-2.jpg  is very pertinent about this. I've saw many water hole like this (not sure about the sand around it ).
* the main problem to me is how you spread all those different ecosystem. You switch tOo quickly from one to another in a random way.
Every ecosystem are covering a much bigger area before switching to an another one but changes to an ecosystem to an another one are quick like you did. There's almost no in-between or blend.
The river in the second picture is exactly what i saw in Svalbard. This kind of ecosystem is present near sea shore for 1 or 2 km.
Further in land the river get finer and more "mono-path" and creates some kind of  small canyon (10 meter depth) with less sand and more rocks. More you go in land more the vegetal part came closer from water.
*Water in sandy part is very yellow brown and non transparent. Water in tundra is crystal clear. River Water is clear further in land.
*you could add an new echosystem between tundra and sandy parts in some place : voronoi cracked clay. Like in deserts. But the clay is so "strong" water slip on it, it's almost like a  non Newtonian fluid. A friend of mine loose his boots in this shit !!!! If you run it's solid if you stop or walk too slow you gonna be trapped.  :P
*Rocks should be visible only on sandy rocky part. They are present in green parts but they're should be fully covered by moss. As i say the moss is very very thick. You can run and  jump face on ground without any damage. It's "bouncy"and confortable.

Hope it help.

Anyway you render are already very interesting.


 
« Last Edit: October 13, 2014, 02:43:22 AM by ndeewolfwood »

Offline Oshyan

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #12 on: October 13, 2014, 04:00:32 AM »
The close-up with the lake and snow (?) patches looks really excellent!

- Oshyan

Offline Dune

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #13 on: October 13, 2014, 07:47:08 AM »
Thanks very much Ndee! That's information I can work with, very interesting. I'll google Svalbard as well, see what comes up in terms of reference.
As a matter of fact I already had my reservations about the smallscale differences, and have wondered if it shouldn't be less diverse, but more equal, and depending on distance to the tributaries. This is an area where the highest parts (the sandy dune area in front) are only 18m above the bottom of the rivers. Very little height differences on the whole, except the front area.
Work to do! Thanks again!

Offline Dune

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Re: Post-Glacial
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2014, 02:07:45 PM »
Redone with larger biotope patches and an attempt to procedurally find depressions for the clumps of trees, that I was asked to put in. Still not sure about the 'ditches' leading to the tributary, they should probably be not sandy but grown over. The melting snow remains will be less bluish and widespread, more like snowheaps; it smoothes the heather too much here.

 

anything