Digitial Domain and Student Tuition

Started by rcallicotte, March 29, 2012, 11:17:34 am

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rcallicotte

So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

TheBadger

March 29, 2012, 11:51:12 am #1 Last Edit: March 29, 2012, 12:04:15 pm by TheBadger
This article makes me mad as hell!
If everything in the article is true I would support unionization. So long as the union did not become just another paid agent of leftist politics (I know I'm asking a lot)
Dam, at least a Guild with some power!

Anyone who pays to take this program is a fool. You would be better off taking a job for 10$ an hour than going 100,000$ into debt (with interest rates), for a chance to maybe get a full time job for 30-40hr. Such bullshit! This really makes me mad. I almost cannot believe its a true story. These programs are exploitation, and I'm saying this as a conservative.
It has been eaten.

rcallicotte

What is interesting is that there are close ties here in Planetside to Digital Domain, so I'm hoping for varying points of view.
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

rcallicotte

Just to show some other experienced professionals' opinions and conjectures about the future of VFx - http://forums.luxology.com/discussion/topic.aspx?id=64713&page=1

I'm very willing to talk to anyone about this, if anyone wants to.  It's a mess, in my opinion.
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

AP

I had wanted to go to an art school for a time some time back but the more i investigated that most of these schools are connected to the Fannie Mae Government-based loans, that was the end of that. For one, i have zero trust for Fannie Mae and am not willing to risk spending thirty years or so paying of unrealistically high tuition fees. The diploma is no guarantee and a job is no guarantee so what am i doing, studying at home and not going into debt.

AP

I would not mind working for free if someone was hurting so much that they needed those services badly and i felt in my heart to voluntarily help someone, however a means of monetary compensation is only fair in most cases. If i provide a good and or service then the reward for my hard work should be some means of being compensated while the individual or party is provided for. A negotiable and fair trade off serving the interests of everyone. That is real Capitalism.

rcallicotte

I completely agree.  As far as defining Capitalism, what matters to me is that before it was called Capitalism, it was common sense.  You give me a loaf of bread because I gave you milk from the goat I keep.  Anything else is disastrous, but some people just don't want to work because stealing from others seems easier...including businesses.


Quote from: ChrisC on March 29, 2012, 03:53:43 pm
I would not mind working for free if someone was hurting so much that they needed those services badly and i felt in my heart to voluntarily help someone, however a means of monetary compensation is only fair in most cases. If i provide a good and or service then the reward for my hard work should be some means of being compensated while the individual or party is provided for. A negotiable and fair trade off serving the interests of everyone. That is real Capitalism.
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

AP

Quote from: calico on March 29, 2012, 04:13:12 pm
I completely agree.  As far as defining Capitalism, what matters to me is that before it was called Capitalism, it was common sense.  You give me a loaf of bread because I gave you milk from the goat I keep.  Anything else is disastrous, but some people just don't want to work because stealing from others seems easier...including businesses.


Indeed.    :)

TheBadger

March 29, 2012, 06:36:29 pm #8 Last Edit: March 29, 2012, 06:40:01 pm by TheBadger
Quote from: ChrisC on March 29, 2012, 03:44:41 pm
...The diploma is no guarantee and a job is no guarantee so what am i doing, studying at home and not going into debt.


I applaud your wisdom ChrisC. Truly.
In modern art schools across the country (University system), the modernist perspective that artistry cannot be taught has been widely adopted. What this means is that the schools believe that talent is intrinsic and students have it or they do not. The result is that all they try to teach is technique or method (tutorials). This makes university instruction no better than a trade education. Or learning by your self on the net, and probably not even as good as that.

Art history (cultural/intellectual) is debased even further. Where understanding of meaning and intent was once the focus of art history studies, now all you learn is names and dates. It is now considered an unscholarly question to ask if something is true! This is a terrible insult to all art, since for the last 3000 years (until the modern age) all art was solely concerned with Truth. (Truth; Athena, Colombia, the holy spirit ect.) And the consequences of Truth (cultural/intellectual).

When applying for a job now, no one cares where you went to school. And why should they?. They only care if, and how well you can do the work, and that is what a demo is for.

I'm not saying people should not go to college. I'm just saying make sure you know why you want to go. Know the program, the teachers and what they are going to teach. Otherwise your just wasting time and money.

In my un-humble opinion, college has become a racket. Not all everywhere, but mostly. Certainly where the fine arts are concerned.

Quote from: calico on March 29, 2012, 12:08:41 pm
What is interesting is that there are close ties here in Planetside to Digital Domain...


What do you mean by this? I doubt anyone here is getting some kind of kickback from the Digital Domain business model.
It has been eaten.

AP

Yes, i was so desperate to get into school that i should have taken time out to research my decision early on but later i thought it over and over, read what these schools are getting away with and the unreasonable amount of loans to take out, the next bubble to burst as tuition can only be artificially inflated so much and these models cannot work. No reason what so ever tuition costs should be the way they are. In the end, learning at home is more affordable and you do not have to take to some standard nor hate some professor for the day. The nice element of art is there are no real rules and no standard of how something should be done or some favored technique. I classify myself as a realist (certain rules do apply) in art but my approach and techniques would not be the same as what a school might dictate and that can hinder a visionary. It is certainly a racket, mostly.

rcallicotte

@TheBadger - Matt once worked at Digital Domain and has even done some work for them since then. 
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

rcallicotte

While I agree training is mostly inept nowadays, I do have a disagreement with this statement and since it's my thread I don't mind a small diversion.   ;D

It really is sort of related, though.  Art has rules - rules of perspective, of color, of light, of understanding medium...to name a few.  For example, one of the things zBrush experts say again and again is how important understanding anatomy is and being able to create accurate anatomy is foundational to create any other sort of creature like a human or completely different than human.

So there are ways things should be done and taught and learned.

Quote from: ChrisC on March 30, 2012, 02:42:59 am
The nice element of art is there are no real rules and no standard of how something should be done or some favored technique. 
So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

AP

I think what i should have meant was one's style, teaching methods and one's personal approach but yes, the fundamentals do have rules. I think with surrealism and abstracts you can bend the rules to some degree though. Picasso is a good example.

rcallicotte

So this is Disney World.  Can we live here?

Oshyan

Just to be clear, there is no ongoing affiliation or cooperation between Planetside and Digital Domain, formal or otherwise.

Speaking personally, not on behalf of Planetside, I am disappointed by a major player in the industry moving in this direction. It's a tough industry to be in on either end - as employer or employee - but I think this is just exploiting people.

- Oshyan