Author Topic: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion  (Read 372250 times)

Offline JimB

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #750 on: May 27, 2008, 08:22:55 AM »
i mean any scene created in the new alpha isnt even compatible with the old build all that shows up is just a white sceen and about 200 error messages
Check the Background shader's Surface shader in the node view's Object section. Has the colour changed to white?
Some bits and bobs
The Galileo Fallacy, 'Argumentum ad Galileus':
"They laughed at Galileo. They're laughing at me. Therefore I am the next Galileo."

Nope. Galileo was right for the simpler reason that he was right.

lightning

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #751 on: May 27, 2008, 08:28:31 AM »
i mean any scene created in the new alpha isnt even compatible with the old build all that shows up is just a white sceen and about 200 error messages
Check the Background shader's Surface shader in the node view's Object section. Has the colour changed to white?
nope it just normal the only edition to the scene is 200 fu*cking errors
« Last Edit: May 27, 2008, 08:35:35 AM by lightning »

Offline nikita

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #752 on: May 27, 2008, 08:36:46 AM »
In the previous build, you have to activate shadow casting on the background shader.


Sometimes it seems people get more and more disappointed the better TG2 gets ^^

lightning

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #753 on: May 27, 2008, 08:43:17 AM »
In the previous build, you have to activate shadow casting on the background shader.


Sometimes it seems people get more and more disappointed the better TG2 gets ^^
i wouldn't exactly call the latest build 'better' the transparency isnt that great and takes eons to render, well i dont know what you would call the latest renderer maybe a word best not mentioned. and the multi threading sux it only recognizes 2 of my 4 cores and only 2 of dads 8 core computer >:(

I cant beleive people are being so obtuse about whats actually happening >:(
dandelo's right when you think we have been waiting soooooooooooooo long for this all mighty final build thats supposed to blow ever one away
and look what we have got............. a piece of shit alpha (not even beta!!) 
« Last Edit: May 27, 2008, 08:56:29 AM by lightning »

Offline JimB

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #754 on: May 27, 2008, 09:08:23 AM »
The only likely way for these concerns to be addressed is for Planetside to increase the price quite a bit and take on more people, which would be fine by me.
Some bits and bobs
The Galileo Fallacy, 'Argumentum ad Galileus':
"They laughed at Galileo. They're laughing at me. Therefore I am the next Galileo."

Nope. Galileo was right for the simpler reason that he was right.

Offline PG

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #755 on: May 27, 2008, 09:45:12 AM »
Can we not start this argument again? Don't even think we're ten pages from the last time. Yes the alpha has it's problems, not that I've had many of them, but it is an unstable release as planetside have said. Yes the development time is longer than anticipated but that's software development of you, it's a pain in the ass but even the best of companies have this problem. Hell Mafia 2 was delayed for a full 2 years because of financial problems IS were having with their publisher, Splinter Cell was delayed for about 7 months at least because it needed to be completely restarted to change the entire concept so it didn't resemble Assassin's Creed so much.
The only reason that Planetside seem to be taking so long is because they let us in at the beginning of development, which very, very, very, very, very few developers do, normally we look at an upcoming game, think it's cool, then forget about it for a few months. With Terragen most of us are here every day and so the development seems to take a long time. That's all it is, if we were on the outside trust me it wouldn't seem as long.
Figured out how to do clicky signatures

dandelO

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #756 on: May 27, 2008, 09:47:37 AM »
The transparency, Jack, looks fantastic I thought, 'not that great' isn't really a fair comment. I think it looks fantastic and I could use that to no end... What doesn't seem too shit hot is the failed multicore renderer, the waste of time spent on UI(who needs a trackball, dockable/multiple windows/etc. or any other new cosmetic update) when there is clearly still LOTS of programming to do in the main? Bells and whistles, I believe, should wait while other more pressing issues are addressed.

All that said, I still have some faith that, in maybe a year or so, PS will have a product worthy of the title 'Second To None'.
The main gripe I think most people are having is that they've pre-paid for a product that should have been here long ago, and what has their money got them? A half decent, nearly stable tech preview 2, and an 'updated' TP3 that appears to work no better, if not worse in many cases.
It is so promising and it will be second to none but, everyone(including PS, I imagine on their part) resents the fact that the final has been promised to the masses so soon, far too early. Their main goal of distributing this product has only been hindered by these announcements as they now have to botch something salvageable(while appearing slightly better than the last builds) to keep the pre-paid public quiet, public who are only relying on the words told to them by the creators.
I am not saying that the team are useless, far from it, the last 'stable' TP BLOWS my mind as to what it can/could do, I use it daily, more than any other program I own actally. I do think, however, that they should have played their cards a little closer to their chest before putting it in black and white that a final product will be available 'soon'. This is bad publicity all round and has/will lose them credit from Joe Public in the long run.

I'm happy to have this TP2 for free. Again though, I won't be pre-paying. I'd like to see what it is I'll actually be buying in the end so, once the Gold release IS ready, consider me first in the queue to download the FREE TRIAL version for evaluation purposes. I hope it will convince me to buy, because I REALLY want to have this, potentialy amazing app, working to it's full ability so that I can work to mine. I won't waste my money though, I've kids to feed, bills to pay etc, as do ALL of the other people who HAVE used their own money for pre-payment. How many bags of groceries could I get for the money? Lol, probably not that many as it is a very reasonable priced app' but, at least I could eat the contents of my shopping bags and get some actual use from them, as opposed to a 'technology preview' of my purchases.

All of the tech' previews, in my mind, should have been released as 'restricted use freeware', there would be NO gripe with that whatsoever, maybe a few folk saying ''Hurry up'' but generaly, people would be grateful all round.

I haven't lost any faith in the teams ability to get this thing good, just some faith in their flippance of statements as to when that will be...

dandelO.

Offline SilverCity

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #757 on: May 27, 2008, 09:54:10 AM »
The only likely way for these concerns to be addressed is for Planetside to increase the price quite a bit and take on more people, which would be fine by me.
Fine by me, as well. I'd gladly pay more for quicker development and a stable final release.

As a tool for hobbyists, T2 is where you'd expect it to be. Some great renders have been created with .09 as well. However, at this point, T2 is still not ready for production work (I know it's still in beta). Render times are too slow, especially for transparency, to be able to make your deadlines. And it seems that the animation tools are not what they should be for a Pro 3D program. That said, for specific types of landscape stills, T2 is the best app out there.

Maybe Planetside needs financial backing from a larger software company. Then Terragen can offer some real competition to Vue. I'm surprised that there hasn't been any other high end vegetation/landscape apps out there, since it seems that no one is happy with what choices we do have.

Offline Mohawk20

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #758 on: May 27, 2008, 10:24:14 AM »
anyway i circled all the parts where this excuses for a renderer missed out anyone else who can see any more chunks that have been ripped out gets a free plant...............

Oh Oh Oh... I want a free plant!!
Where there is a small circle, next to the top big circle on the lower right. Under that circle where the peaks (or atleast the part that rendered) meets the sky.

I want a nice bush please...  :P


I can understand your frustration. But to be honest, I haven't had any big render problems or crashes, except for the renderbucketmemoryleak (you gotta love a word like that  :D).
But systems vary, and so do the problems...
And while you have ever single right to be royally pissed off, I kindly ask I you would go easy on the swearing part.
Howgh!

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Offline JimB

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #759 on: May 27, 2008, 10:50:15 AM »
Before we get too far down the road of it being usable in production, I need to stick up for TG2 a bit here, and it's not arse licking; just making some of you guys realise a plain and simple fact - it is being used in production.

I've been using it on both big flicks and commercials for over a year now, way before multi-threading. TG2 can be so good I've been accused of stitching photos together, and not a single client has questioned the realism of the output, and that's from some seriously scrutinising clients. That includes animated clouds. I can think of large background elements or complete backgrounds for 5 shots that were finalled first time, which is almost unheard of in the vfx industry.

It's really simple: if the job were to involve lots of tree populations in a camera move (a 3D matte painting/environment) I'll run some tests on the trees. No different to using any other app to see if it can do a task required for the job (if you don't then you deserve to have your arse kicked). If the tests fail I'll decline to do the trees, or more likely find a solution for them in another app and integrate them into the TG2 render (let's face it, it can be done, there's little excuse with the lwo output for 3D masking at least).
No offence to anyone, but you need to realise it is being used in deepest darkest anger, on the caveat that it may take a while and if you're prepared to take a little risk. I don't have a massive render farm nor normal access to one.  Most of the time, though, I've managed to turn the job around far more quickly than the other routes available, and therefore far cheaper to the client.

Problem solving is 90% of CGI, and I suggest you try thinking out of the box a bit and don't expect the s/w to be completely reliable or do everything you want it to (haven't used a single app yet in 21 years that works flawlessly - it can always break somehow, even if it cost 40,000 at the time). If you expect any software to be completely reliable, 100%, you'll be disappointed, and that includes the kind of s/w that can kill people if it fails.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2008, 10:58:50 AM by JimB »
Some bits and bobs
The Galileo Fallacy, 'Argumentum ad Galileus':
"They laughed at Galileo. They're laughing at me. Therefore I am the next Galileo."

Nope. Galileo was right for the simpler reason that he was right.

Offline cyphyr

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #760 on: May 27, 2008, 10:53:48 AM »
Absolutely, well said :)
Richard
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Offline nikita

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #761 on: May 27, 2008, 11:08:21 AM »
What doesn't seem too shit hot is the failed multicore renderer, the waste of time spent on UI(who needs a trackball, dockable/multiple windows/etc. or any other new cosmetic update)
I think the GUI improvements are important. Better, more intuitive camera controls in particular has been one of the first and frequently voiced request. I don't think multicore support has failed either. It's working well. Sometimes not all cores are detected, but this is a really minor error that's probably fixed already.

In general, TG2 is already extremely flexible and the images in the gallery (except mine if you will) show what can be done with it. Just because oneself can't do it, doesn't mean that it can't be done and that it'd be software's fault.

However, I think it's legitimate to keep complaining as the delay is still there and some features haven't made it into the program. For example: If you bought the animation edition, you paid $100 more for pretty much nothing (yet).

Offline SilverCity

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #762 on: May 27, 2008, 11:13:47 AM »
Before we get too far down the road of it being usable in production, I need to stick up for TG2 a bit here, and it's not arse licking; just making some of you guys realise a plain and simple fact - it is being used in production.
JimB, thanks for your response. I hadn't realized T2 was being used at all in commercial productions. I stand corrected. I have never been able to get render times down enough, for me to take a chance on a paying job. Maybe I don't know the app well enough to make it work, yet. Once the multi threading situation is worked out, I'll give it another go.

Offline PG

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #763 on: May 27, 2008, 11:44:35 AM »
TG2's been used on lots of films at tv shows. Star trek nemesis is the one on the main planetside website, lots of people have rumoured that it was used on the Golden Compass too
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Offline JimB

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Re: Terragen 2 Release Announcement Discussion
« Reply #764 on: May 27, 2008, 11:50:30 AM »
Star trek nemesis is the one on the main planetside website, lots of people have rumoured that it was used on the Golden Compass too
It's not a rumour, I used it for a good chunk of the environment surrounding the Gyptian camp. There's also a complete sky in Rome season 2  ;)
« Last Edit: May 27, 2008, 11:53:00 AM by JimB »
Some bits and bobs
The Galileo Fallacy, 'Argumentum ad Galileus':
"They laughed at Galileo. They're laughing at me. Therefore I am the next Galileo."

Nope. Galileo was right for the simpler reason that he was right.

 

anything